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View Full Version : Endgame Cleric: Empower Healing???



Jaysensen
08-18-2007, 05:14 PM
Okay, so how good is Empower Healing? When is it good? When is it not good?


A very good player asked if I had it, and also happened to "worry" about my 2 Rog levels. Personally, I cast 3 spells: Mass Cure Mod, Heal, and Cure Crit. Anything less, I wand it. Rare occasions, such a Reaver, I cast Serious also. Because of my playstyle, I figured that Empower Healing would be ineffcient. But I got to thinking, could I be better?

DemonMage
08-18-2007, 05:41 PM
Empower Healing is never inefficient unless you're restoring more hp than the target has lost.
It's 50% more for 50% more cost.
It becomes more efficient for the spells you cast with the patch, when it becomes just a flat +10 SP cost.

With Mass and Cure Crit you're not likely to overheal too often if you're paying attention. You'll frequently overheal with Heal with Empower on, unless you're healing barbs.

But you have to ask yourself how frequently you run with people with over 300-400 hp. Do you find yourself having to cast another heal because you didn't restore enough with the three types of heals you use? If so, Empower Healing will provide you a potentially important boost in HPS for no loss in HPM.

I have it, I almost never toggle it on anymore. Prior to Heal and especially before finding things past Devotion 1/2 was common, it was a very powerful and valuable feat. These days, it's of less use, even if you are healing someone with 600 hp.

Placenta
08-18-2007, 05:50 PM
Remember those empower heals can be used on undead for massive damage at times. Depends on how you play.

DemonMage
08-18-2007, 05:55 PM
That would be one of the few times I do toggle it on =-p

Blazer
08-18-2007, 07:20 PM
I don't have Empower Healing anymore and I don't miss it. Clerics currently only get 5 feats (6 if human) and there are better options for "endgame". I ditched it last mod and haven't looked back. Bottom line: are you keeping everyone upright and not having to rely on wands/scrolls? If so, you're doing just fine - I wouldn't bother picking up Emp. Healing.

Sojourner
08-19-2007, 10:43 PM
Basically it boils down your playstyle and who you typically run with.

The major points are:

Empower Healing is NOT good if:
You are player that almost always heals using the 'heal' spell, scrolls, and wands.
You habitually top off everyone's HP



Empower healing IS good if:
You run with a lot of barbarians (or high HP fighters) and/or warforged
You use 'mass cure' spells regularly
You need quicker recycle casting times on your cure spells

Gennerik
08-20-2007, 07:50 AM
Basically it boils down your playstyle and who you typically run with.

The major points are:

Empower Healing is NOT good if:
You are player that almost always heals using the 'heal' spell, scrolls, and wands.
You habitually top off everyone's HP

Empower healing IS good if:
You run with a lot of barbarians (or high HP fighters) and/or warforged
You use 'mass cure' spells regularly
You need quicker recycle casting times on your cure spells

I keep it on all the time, and I stick with Cure Light Wounds and Cure Moderate Wounds for healing. Melee classes I let take a beating and use Heal (May or may not switch Empowered Healing off, depending on if it's in the middle of a fight or not), and when the group takes damage I throw out a Mass Cure Light Wounds (though I do have Mass Cure Moderate Wounds on the hotbar in case I need to chain cast them). Doing this, I keep people alive, don't use scrolls, and only use wands on raids (if then).

samhuinn
08-20-2007, 08:31 AM
I keep it on all the time, and I stick with Cure Light Wounds and Cure Moderate Wounds for healing. Melee classes I let take a beating and use Heal (May or may not switch Empowered Healing off, depending on if it's in the middle of a fight or not), and when the group takes damage I throw out a Mass Cure Light Wounds (though I do have Mass Cure Moderate Wounds on the hotbar in case I need to chain cast them). Doing this, I keep people alive, don't use scrolls, and only use wands on raids (if then).

This is more or less the same thing I do. I've tested running with out empower, and I just like having it on, more than not. I usually let people (especially high hp barbs and fighters) drop fairly low before I throw some cures on 'em, and I rarely wand whip or worry about having everyone completely topped off. Ya fight just as well with 200HP as you do with 250 so I don't find it necessary.

moops
08-20-2007, 04:30 PM
Both my level 14 clerics have kept it, I commented why on other threads, but basically I like to use the Mass Heals and empower makes them really nice.

Also I don't like to baby sit, I like to cast alot, and if I can throw one empowered Cure Mod and be done with it Im quit ehappy.

RemoJr
08-20-2007, 05:08 PM
i love empower healing and would never drop it. Heal scrolls in the reaver raid and other bad situations just don't cut it. A real heal isn't much more then a heal scroll, i need that extra 50% healing. Especially when your healing meleers with 500+ hp.

Blazer
08-20-2007, 05:15 PM
i love empower healing and would never drop it. Heal scrolls in the reaver raid and other bad situations just don't cut it. A real heal isn't much more then a heal scroll, i need that extra 50% healing. Especially when your healing meleers with 500+ hp.

Dunno how you've got your gear/enhancement set up on your cleric, but on my cleric, casting Heal from my SP pool dwarfs the results I get from a scroll. And once again I must ask/state - why use scrolls during the reaver raid? You get unlimited mana.

Gennerik
08-21-2007, 08:46 AM
i love empower healing and would never drop it. Heal scrolls in the reaver raid and other bad situations just don't cut it. A real heal isn't much more then a heal scroll, i need that extra 50% healing. Especially when your healing meleers with 500+ hp.

I guess you have the increased Wand/Scrolls Enhancements to say that. I know for me that I'd only Heal 110 for a scroll and I Heal 399 when I cast it, which makes it a big difference. But yeah, Heal Scrolls in raids help, but they are hardly enough to rely solely on if things start going south.

Grenfell
08-21-2007, 09:00 AM
Basically it boils down your playstyle and who you typically run with.

The major points are:

Empower Healing is NOT good if:
You are player that almost always heals using the 'heal' spell, scrolls, and wands.
You habitually top off everyone's HP



Empower healing IS good if:
You run with a lot of barbarians (or high HP fighters) and/or warforged
You use 'mass cure' spells regularly
You need quicker recycle casting times on your cure spells


This list, while good, is missing a MAJOR consideration.

Battleclerics should always have Empower Healing active.

You simply cannot fight and heal efficiently without Empower Healing -- you don't have the time to sit back and wand/scroll and cast Heal. You must rely on burst healing as you need the time to swing a sword yourself. You must minimize the time window in which your healing spell can be interrupted (and Concentration checks are not 100% guaranteed).

I rely heavily on CMW with Empower Healing when in fighting mode -- the shorter casting time, shorter recharge time, with very decent "stabilizer" results are all worth it. Stabilizing means getting someone up to a "won't die next round" point, then popping a Heal (after my own swing sequence is done).

If you're a healbot/caster cleric, then other choices may be better, but for the fighting priest, Empower Healing is absolutely critical. Just try fighting without it turned on and compare results.

/gren

Zenako
08-21-2007, 09:05 AM
The single biggest factor for me is the RATE of healing that Empowered healing lets you maintain if needed. As others mentioned in the current scheme it is a 1/1 cost so no hit there. It also lets all of the curing spells be more effective for the time taken. Sometimes you NEED to burn through a number of spells in a VERY short time and waiting for cooldowns is not a viable option and scrolls are slow compared to casting. With some nice Devotion items, a few enhancements, etc, you can do some serious healing with the mid level cure spells and very large numbers (albeit often overkill with HEAL). The cooldown on the lower level spells is shorter as well. Since you have at least one CURE spell of every level hardwired, I have them all on a hotbar to cycle through if needed.

Harbinder
08-21-2007, 09:11 AM
Gren speaks the truth. Also it's better to have it when you need it ie: when you group with 400+ HP tanks, than to burn through more Heal scrolls than you need to. Not to mention when you're in combat those empowered cure mass spells really keep those red bars up better.

BTW, does Empower or Maximize work on heals? Did it used to? Think I remember hearing it did a long time ago. :confused:

Zenako
08-21-2007, 09:15 AM
Empower should work, don't think Maximize would however since there is no variable damage in HEAL.

Think of EMPOWER Healing as DPS for clerics! DPS is important for fighters, and Healing DPS can be just as important for Healers. If you are healing someone constantly between 25% and 60% of health, and again as soon as you can when the cooldown resets, then with Empower, you can heal from 25% to 77% of health, do something else or help someone else and then get back to the damage sink again. It really helps with Time management and triage on a rapidly changing battlescene.

As a side effect, try running undead quests, get your group to cluster with you and then drop the old Mass Cure Serious down, toggled with DLIII and then another MassCSW. Some nice DPS if you think about it. Plus you keep everyone on your side in the peak of health as well.

samhuinn
08-21-2007, 09:37 AM
As a side effect, try running undead quests, get your group to cluster with you and then drop the old Mass Cure Serious down, toggled with DLIII and then another MassCSW. Some nice DPS if you think about it. Plus you keep everyone on your side in the peak of health as well.

"You Heal hit The Thirsty One for 594 Positive Damage"

Another reason for Empower Healing :)

Zenako
08-21-2007, 09:43 AM
With a nice series of Empowered HEALs, Superior Radienced Searing Lights, and Empowered Cure Crits, you can make most uber undead beg for mercy pretty quick.... The cooldown timers work out pretty well to keep those firing in a non-stop series and not let the bugger recover.