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mark_redfern
08-10-2007, 07:28 PM
if someone could post a batman build thats mostly ruge thta would be fantastic. becasue i ave been unable to find one any where. or even a link where to find one.

tanks

binnsr
08-10-2007, 08:16 PM
There's not really a 'batman' build for a mostly rogue character. The whole point of the batman build was that it was almost no rogue.

In lieue of a 'batman', I'll give you my Combat Engineer..

10rog/2ftr/2pal drow

STR 10 +1enh +5 item = 16
DEX 16 +2lvlup +2 favor tome +5 enh +5item = 30
CON 10 +4 item = 14 (tome and +5 would be handy here)
INT 16 +1 lvlup +6item +1 tome = 24
WIS 12 +5 item +1 tome = 18
CHA 16 +4item = 20

1rog - Toughness (or TWF if you prefer - i did)
2ftr - Weapon Finesse
3pal - skill focus: UMD
4pal
5rog
6rog - Combat Expertise
7-8 rog
9 rog - Nimble Fingers (or Improved Two Weapon Fighting) (or Quick Draw - you really don't need NF)
10ftr - Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons
11rog
12rog - Dodge
13-14rog
15rog (when the cap goes up again) - Greater Two Weapon Fighting or Weapon Focus: Piercing Weapons

Up until a couple of weeks go, I had sf:dd and nimble fingers at 1 and 9, respectively and just swapped them out for TWF/iTWF because they are both overkill on this build.

max ranks in DD, OL, Spot, Search, UMD, Haggle, Balance and Tumble at rogue levels. At melee levels, concentrate on DD, search and alternate on OL. Use the rogue levels to catch up - by 14, everything but hide/MS should be maxed.

Skills: (disclaimer - this rogue can't see or disable the Cabal for One niche trap, and frankly, it's just not worth the effort)
DD: 52 (high water mark is 56)
OL: 55 (high water mark is ~36)
Srch: 49 (high water mark is ~50)
Spot: 43 (high water mark is 36)
Haggle: 39
These values are 17 ranks +stat +WotM +enh (below) +tools (+5) +greater heroism and a +13 item.
They do not include skill boost II (required for WoTM

Saves:
F: 20 / 26 = 3(ftr) +3(pal) +3(rog) +2(stat) +5(divine grace) +1(Aura) +3(item) +4(GH) +2(Recitation)
R: 24 / 33 / 39 = 0(ftr) +0(pal) +7(rog) +10(stat) +5(divine grace) +1(Aura) +3(item) +4(GH) +2(Recitation) +1(Haste) +6(Improved Uncanny Dodge)
W: 16 / 22 = 0(ftr) +0(pal) +3(rog) +4(stat) +5(divine grace) +1(Aura) +3(item) +4(GH) +2(Recitation)

Hit Points
158 nekked (174 if toughness is taken at 1st lvl) -- not too many, but I rarely die, so it can't be all bad..
296hp fully buffed with toughnees and a greater false life item

AC:
10 base
9 +5 Mithril Chain Shirt
6 Dexterity bonus
1 Dodge Feat
4 +4 protection item (i have a +5 rr but those are still pretty rare)
1 Paladin Aura
2 Chaosgarde (farmable)
= 39 standing around town TWF
+7 +5 Heavy Mithril Shield
= 46 standing around
+3 barkskin pot
+1 haste
+2 recitation
= 51 common buffs
+5 combat Expertise
= 56 defensive posture
+2 Ranger Barkskin
+3 Paladin Aura (full pally)
+2 Daggertooth Belt (this forces you to sacrifice con down to a +3 for +2ac)
+3 Chattering Ring (only part of this that I don't have :()
= 62 Max
+6 Improved Uncanny Dodge
= 68 Max for :30 3x/rest..

Enhancements:
Rogue Skill Boost I
Rogue Skill Boost II
Elven Dexterity I
Elven Dexterity II
Rogue Dexterity I
Rogue Dexterity II
Rogue Dexterity III
Fighter Strength I
Rogue Disable Device I
Rogue Disable Device II
Rogue Open Lock I
Rogue Open Lock II
Roge Search I
Rogue Search II
Rogue Improved Trap Sense I
Rogue Acid Lore I (any will work - is a prereq for WoTM)
Rogue Subtle BackStabber I
Rogue Subtle BackStabber II
Rogue Subtle BackStabber III
Way of the Mechanic I
Fighter Item Defense I
Elven Perception I
Elven Perception II
Elven Keen Eyes I (spot)
Rogue Spot I
Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I


You could make him an intimirogue by substituting Intimidate for Bluff at skills. This character is very survivable on the battlefield, and is quite capable of stepping in for the cleric or arcane if needed (at lvl12, he did VoN3 as the wizard using scrolls and wands) His weak link is that he's pretty gear dependant - without the mithril gear, the ASF is sky-high; without the chaosgarde, the mithril shirt, and the protection necklace, his AC isn't high enough to bother with a shield - making the heavy fort item even more of a *must*.

He's a lot of fun to play, even without everyone wanting traps disabled these days ..

mark_redfern
08-10-2007, 11:23 PM
thank you, i was just wondering if there was any advantage to go 10 rogue, 1 fighter, 3 paly, what are the advantages of going 2 fighter?

Cowdenicus
08-11-2007, 12:27 AM
thank you, i was just wondering if there was any advantage to go 10 rogue, 1 fighter, 3 paly, what are the advantages of going 2 fighter?

1 extra feat

binnsr
08-11-2007, 01:41 AM
yeah .. although this build really doesn't need the extra feat -- it did when i originally made him for a lvl10 cap. take the 3rd pally level at 8 or so and the rogue from there on out..

If you took the 1 fighter level at 14 and didn't mind waiting until 3rd for Finesse, you could get greater TWF in there too..

edit: you also get fighter str I by taking the second level of fighter .. not a huge deal, but it gives me a wee bit extra str for now.. (a +1 str tome would serve the same purpose)

mark_redfern
08-13-2007, 12:03 AM
ok thanks for the help!! much apreciated.
have fun

Impaqt
08-13-2007, 12:13 AM
Hit Points
158 nekked (174 if toughness is taken at 1st lvl) -- not too many, but I rarely die, so it can't be all bad..
296hp fully buffed with toughnees and a greater false life item

AC:
10 base
9 +5 Mithril Chain Shirt
6 Dexterity bonus
1 Dodge Feat
4 +4 protection item (i have a +5 rr but those are still pretty rare)
1 Paladin Aura
2 Chaosgarde (farmable)
= 39 standing around town TWF
+7 +5 Heavy Mithril Shield
= 46 standing around
+3 barkskin pot
+1 haste
+2 recitation
= 51 common buffs
+5 combat Expertise
= 56 defensive posture
+2 Ranger Barkskin
+3 Paladin Aura (full pally)
+2 Daggertooth Belt (this forces you to sacrifice con down to a +3 for +2ac)
+3 Chattering Ring (only part of this that I don't have :()
= 62 Max
+6 Improved Uncanny Dodge
= 68 Max for :30 3x/rest..



Please Check your Math and SHow me how exactly you get to 296 Hit points....
10 base
9 +5 Mithril Chain Shirt
6 Dexterity bonus
1 Dodge Feat
4 +4 protection item (i have a +5 rr but those are still pretty rare)
1 Paladin Aura
2 Chaosgarde (farmable)
---
33 != 39

Aeneas
08-13-2007, 07:40 AM
If you're looking for a so called "batman" rogue, my intimirogue is a high AC, high saves, high intimidate rogue build. 10 rogue/2 fighter/2 pally. Taking a 3rd level of paladin really just gives you fear immunity and disease immunity. Disease immune items are easy to get, and fear immunity is granted by a couple items as well as greater heroism. You're better off taking the feat.

Also, by the sheer fact that it's a mainly rogue build, it's not a batman build. Batman's were built around a paladin core, the super sturdy rogue 3 way mixes are built around a high dex character who also receives improved evasion, improved uncanny dodge, backstab dice, and the ability to take things like backstab enhancements, rogue action boost, and rogue dex 3.

binnsr
08-13-2007, 09:13 AM
Please Check your Math and SHow me how exactly you get to 296 Hit points....
10 base
9 +5 Mithril Chain Shirt
6 Dexterity bonus
1 Dodge Feat
4 +4 protection item (i have a +5 rr but those are still pretty rare)
1 Paladin Aura
2 Chaosgarde (farmable)
---
33 != 39

Here's where I had the discrepancies there.. I forgot to remove daggertooth's belt (FAM II +2) and the chattering ring (+3 dodge) on my spreadsheet so those ended up getting double-counted at the end :o Also, were you to acquire a KDS (still haven't gotten one for my rogue), your AC would go up by one.

As for hitpoints, here's the breakdown
20 heroic durability
10 Argonessen Favor
28 Con (10 base +4 item = 14 -- goes to 42 with a +5/1tome or +6 item)
20 2ftr
20 2pal
60 10rog
= 158 nekked (as advertised)
+16 toughness
+30 Greater False Life item
= 204 permanent
+18 Aid
+20 Virtue
+20 Inspire Greatness
+14 Greater Heroism
+20 False Life Spell
= 296 Fully buffed (with 92 temporary hitpoints)

You could add another +5hp if you took ftr/pal toughness I enhancements.