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cridus
08-07-2007, 07:35 PM
Since I'm a new player, I don't have a high level toon funneling gold to my support cleric. I'm only lvl 5 as well but I have teamed a lot and haven't really bought anything. Everything I wear is stuff I found. So I've built up about 40k gold. Well recently I was in a party that didn't go so well, it was a lvl 7 quest in house P and there were a ton of traps all over the place, the team had no rogue and the team leader was only a lvl 3 barbarian. (Holla for PUG's) Now the Barb must of had a high level toon funneling him some cash cause he was still tearing through all the trolls and bugbears so I guess he had a nice weapon. Problem is since he was only lvl 3 he was taking hordes and hordes of damage. Now as support cleric I pride myself in the fact that I was able to keep him on his feet. We also have a lvl 6 pure fighter who had well over 100 HP. Well needless to say I easily was blowing through all my SP in about 2 encounters. So now I'm basically a fighter, as I have no SP to cast my spells.

First thing that the party asks me is "do you have any wands?"
Well i had a wand of cure light wounds ( not much help and that was empty in no time )
So after the quest I ask where I can get some wands. and I get directed to the bazaar, so I head off on my quest to purchase some wands.

I find the bazaar easily enough, after about 10 minutes of strolling around the bazaar I finally find the wand seller. Why he is all the way up there is beyond me but I digress.
I scroll through his list of wands and find what I'm looking for, a "wand of cure moderate wounds."
50 charges , that oughta help keep a party alive....then I look at the price tag.......what are people on teams nuts, they want me to shell out 5k for a wand to use on them to keep them alive. Now don't get me wrong I bought 3, but these are only going to be used in dire circumstances, those 3 wands cost me 15k+ gold, but if I'm running say tangleroot. (did it last night, very long but fun) I know that I would have blown through at least 1 of those wands if I had it on me.
What I'm inquiring is I am a support cleric, do most teams expect me to bust out my wand when I have no SP to keep them alive all the time. I won't be able to save up any gold if all teams expect that.

Is there anyway to avoid going broke as a support cleric???

Impaqt
08-07-2007, 07:38 PM
"I'm a New Player and cant afford an endless supply of wands"

Chances are, they would of given ya some plat....

Jaysensen
08-07-2007, 08:22 PM
Yeah, just ask, and most people are willing to donate to the cause.

cridus
08-07-2007, 08:28 PM
I'm not a big fan of asking for handouts though, I'm going to try and carry a supply of wands but if I'm in a party like I was earlier, a lot of over aggro and needless damage I'm going to forget I have them, but if the team is working well together then I will certainly pull out my "wand of save butt" and start tossing the heals around like I'm Harry Potter.

If a teammate wants to toss me a few plats for keeping them standing then I don't look at that as panhandling, I look at it as services rendered. :)

Impaqt
08-07-2007, 09:21 PM
Your going to be very dissapointed.......

The vast majority of players have several alts and have been playing for a very long time. Stating that your a new player is NOT "Panhandling" Its just giving the rest of the party a heads up. What they do withthat info is up to them.

PurdueDave
08-07-2007, 11:36 PM
What they do withthat info is up to them.

Which might be using potions, helping with the wands for paladins/rangers/bards, etc. Not necessarily a handout per se. If memory serves, 4K plat at level 5 is a pretty decent pile for starting from scratch so you're doing OK.

Frodo_Lives
08-08-2007, 12:39 AM
By all means speak up. It's not panhandling, it's being honest with the group and letting them know that you aren't going to burn through tons of wands and why.

If your first character is a cleric then to be honest I'd be a little choosy about what quests I'd do with what groups. PuGs can be a ton of fun, but they can also be a mess if the group bites off more than it can chew.

Stick to quests that are around your level, and you probably will still have that CLW wand until you are level 7. I have found that there really isn't a lot of wand healing needed until lvl 8 or 9 as long as you are not running quests that are way over your head.

Harbinder
08-08-2007, 12:49 AM
What is a support cleric?

AMERON
08-08-2007, 05:45 AM
a good guild is usually easier on a cleric than a p.u.g., our guild sends all of our clerics wands and plat...i would look for a good guild if you are not in one

but the above posters are right, usually people will donate to help out since healers are a commodity

Crud
08-08-2007, 08:14 AM
It's not asking for a hand out. It's stating the reality that your ability to heal is quickly running out due to conditions beyond your control and if the party wants to continue said quest then the cleric needs some support as well.
I've found that when I tell the group, " guys I'm burning through wands like kindlin and the mannas going way to fast" that 1 or 2 of the group will step in and help out with either wands or plat. Usually it's the players that aren't taking damage that help out.

flynnsane
08-08-2007, 09:12 AM
You may also want to try some Crowd Control casting.

Sound Burst on the Caster types and Command on the melee types. Mitigating dmg is much better than healing it. More fun, too ;)

I don't think I bought more than 3 wands until I reached lvl 10 (course, in GH I spend about 5k Plat in Heal scrolls).

Anywho, my 2 cents....

Zenako
08-08-2007, 09:45 AM
Let the party know your situation. If they are vets with handme downs, many of them might also be carrying wands for use or to handout. I know I carry a few Repair Wands on my low level WF fighter to hand to a caster in the party.

For a starting character, your cash pile was a good one. But as you will soon see, gold comes and goes and is easier and easier to replace once you get a few levels under your belt.

As for running out of spell points early. As others have said, you need to look at how you are using them and what spells you have focused and what gear you are using.

Crowd control spells like Sound burst, will stun most monsters for a few seconds, often long enough for your fighters to kill them without even getting hit back. One offensive spell that might replace the net effect of 4 or 5 healing spells later. If you have the Divine Healing Enhancement, that can really stretch out spell points at all levels. The right resist spells can prevent a lot of damage from ever being taken.

I also have found that in less then full parties, that I would summon up a MSI or MS2 or 3 depending on my spell mix to give the mobs something to fight that is completely expendable, that attracts attention, that will produce flanking bonus opportunities, that will even do some damage to mobs and leave your party freeer to attack more things without getting hit back. I could solo with my cleric at most levels and the MS spells are VERY useful to making mana go farther. Shield of Faith on the 2 handed wielding barbarian will give him some AC that should make a difference at low to mid levels.

Bottom line, as you learn the game more, you will find better and better ways to use your spells to extract the maximum benefit. You need to be both Proactive (buffs, resists, MS), active (Sound bursts, Searing Light, Nimbus) and reactive (healing) to get the best bang for your mana.

As for spending money on wands. If you see a fighter getting damaged but never healing themselves, ask them why? Do they carry any healing potions with them? Clerical healing should be mostly focused on during encounters keeping the party functional, but after the battle, unless you have plenty of mana available, most people should expect to get themselves up to a level of health they are comfortable with. (A lot of this changes as you reach higher levels, but by then, the costs for supplies like Cure Serious Wands and potions is no longer a huge issue.) Also do not worry about "topping" people off. It is a waste of your mana to cast a Cure Spell on someone with only a few points of injury.

Finally, be sure to locate and find a nice Healing Devotion Item (or a Potency item if you find it.) The Helm of Faith, a Silver Flame item that can often be found at the vendors and AH, has Devotion on it which increases the effect of healing spells (lower level ones) by a reasonable %. Makes those spell points go even further.

oronisi
08-08-2007, 09:58 AM
"I'm a New Player and cant afford an endless supply of wands"

Chances are, they would of given ya some plat....


... you guys are all missing the point and redirecting this poor sap. They shouldn't have been taking so much damage, period. If they are taking more damage than a cleric can heal, THEY are the problem. The quest is too high, or too hard, or they just plain suck.

End of story.

rimble
08-08-2007, 10:03 AM
... you guys are all missing the point and redirecting this poor sap. They shouldn't have been taking so much damage, period. If they are taking more damage than a cleric can heal, THEY are the problem. The quest is too high, or too hard, or they just plain suck.

End of story.

So what is your advice for him? Tell them they all suck and drop group? Hold a character building conference? Regardless if the quest is too high, too hard, or they plain suck, a simple "hey guys, no way I can keep up with this healing without lots of wands" is a perfectly valid statement. I also think calling out an individual is reasonable too..."hey Mr. Squishy Mc Suicide...get it under control, or give me lots of cash for wands, you're killin' me here".

I think the advice was spot-on. I've seen way too many Barbarians being rolled recently (mostly Dwarf of course) and the least these people can do if they want you to babysit them is spare a few of their millions of plat for some wands for you.

Sure, I agree that at end-game right now AC is pretty meaningless...but before then it is still VERY meaningful and if these squishy high-hitpoint suicidal maniacs want to make it to high levels they better fork over some cash for the insane resources that OTHERS must expend on their 'uber high-level' build.

Ravery
08-08-2007, 10:04 AM
I have 2 toons, one is a sorc 7 and the other clr 4, I didn't funnel anything to my clr when i made him. But if you just tell the group, listen I am still a rookie as a cleric so bear with me and if you find anything in the chest you don't want i will take it to sell for wands, they will almost always give you what they don't want, I had one guy give me 5K plat just because of that statment, it helps out. I don't think I should have to use money from one toon to support the other, if they want healing and spells, then they need to help out also try to get them to stay together as people who tend to leave the group, die. Good Luck and Let me know if you need any help.

Zenako
08-08-2007, 10:12 AM
... you guys are all missing the point and redirecting this poor sap. They shouldn't have been taking so much damage, period. If they are taking more damage than a cleric can heal, THEY are the problem. The quest is too high, or too hard, or they just plain suck.

End of story.

But some things are within the Clerics power to control directly, the rest depend on getting other players to change. I chose to focus on what the cleric can do, within their current range of abilities and spells (which can be changed/swapped at any rest shrine as well).

You can have a long discussion about DPS vs AC and where the net balance lies for party benefit, but that is another thread entirely. I also agree that it sounds like the party had bitten off more than it could readily chew. Sounds like they might have been in Gwylans Stand what with the quest level and traps making the OP's post. It could be nasty for a bunch of lower levels without a deep pockets support team. I am sorry, but a 3rd level character should not be leading groups into 7th level quests like that with new players. Twinkage can only go so far at 3rd level what with level restrictions on items. Trust me I know.

Grenfell
08-08-2007, 10:30 AM
The true advice for a newcomer to DDO (at this late stage) is never roll a cleric for your first character.

Roll a sorceror or perhaps a paladin -- someone with low operating costs and good income potential. Get to 14, rack up some wealth, and then roll a cleric.

No one wants to rely on handouts from the party. No one wants to feel like he let the party down. The solution is to get cash, then roll the cleric.

/gren

Deusxmachina
08-08-2007, 10:32 AM
Well recently I was in a party that didn't go so well, it was a lvl 7 quest in house P and there were a ton of traps all over the place, the team had no rogue and the team leader was only a lvl 3 barbarian.

I don't think I went through a cure wand more often than "once in awhile" on my cleric until doing raids, and even then I was mainly using wands "just in case" I needed to go full-out with my sp, which was rarely needed. My cleric may not have had the huge amount of gold you hear some people having, but he certainly wasn't broke, either.

There's an important lesson here you just learned, and that lesson is to avoid being main healer for a level 3 in a level 7 quest. (The second lesson is to avoid trap-filled quests if you don't have a trap guy.)

The fastest way to blow cash in DDO is to do quests far above the party's level. And as a cleric, people will expect you to babysit them. I wouldn't bother asking for gold unless you are in a situation like that, but it's a judgment call. If a group wants you to main heal for them in a quest above their level and you don't have or want to spend the cash, tell them straight-out you'll do the wand-whipping if they buy the wands to whip or you'll just use your sp until it's gone.

And don't fall for that "go recall out to get your sp back while we wait here" **** while leveling. Other than in rare circumstances, that's BS. Don't be a wuss cleric.

Aspenor
08-08-2007, 10:35 AM
Is there anyway to avoid going broke as a support cleric???

Since it sounds like you love playing cleric, just be honest with people and tell them you don't have the money to fork out on wand after wand. Most of the time at least one in the party will help you out (I usually hand a new player-cleric about 20K plat, or 200K GP). The money doesn't mean much to me anymore, as well as many others, so don't worry about asking for a hand.

Also, in your situation, I recommend telling the level 3 barb to go buy some potions. If he's got items to twink his level 3 barb, he has some money somewhere to buy potions. DO NOT accept somebody telling you: "it's cheaper for you to heal me" because that is not the issue. Next time tell him to buy some pots, or get get used to running around with 1/3 life.

Strakeln
08-08-2007, 11:16 AM
Yeah, dude, just speak up. Most people are, by the standards you are used to, rich beyond your wildest dreams. You're talking about walking around with 4,000 plat, whereas my *minimum* donation to clerics is always 10,000 plat.

Just phrase it correctly, let everyone know that you don't have a higher level toon supporting you. Almost without fail, someone will donate a big chunk of cash to you.

cridus
08-08-2007, 11:23 AM
Thanks for all the great advice guys. Yes the quest was stand and the traps were eating us all alive, and the twink barb was asking me to recall out, which costs me xp, no thanks.

I was in a quest earlier and when I was out of sp I whipped out one of my wands and saved the party, mentioned that to the group, suddenly I recieved 2 mana pots and 2 full wands of cure serious wounds. I was like "WOW THANKS"
I had no problems whipping my wand out after that to heal up the team at any point, and I'm glad to say there was no deaths, well except for me once when someone pressed a wrong switch and I was standing in front of the trap but that was pretty laughable.

Since I am a new player I don't really know what to expect in a given quest, so because of this I like to have all my remove spells available, after I know the quests a bit I can certainly change my spells around, "sound burst" seems like a very handy spell, I could fit in "command" but as it is single target, I find there is better places to put my SP, I will probably start toting around "prayer" though as that spells really does help parties out.

From now on I'll judge how the party is running, if it's running well and we are progressing nicely I will certainly whip out a wand and toss some heals around, if I need to blow through a few charges I'll mention it to the party. But if I run into another PUG like I did then I will just pleasantly forget I even carry wands.

Thanks again for all the great advice, and yes I do love playing as a cleric, one "Nice Heals" or "Wow you just saved my butt" always makes me appreciate the team.

rimble
08-08-2007, 11:28 AM
Thanks for all the great advice guys. Yes the quest was stand and the traps were eating us all alive, and the twink barb was asking me to recall out, which costs me xp, no thanks.

Wow! Now that's some nerve! Deffinitely some twinked alt used to casters recalling for mana in PoP or wherever. That would certainly set me off on a tirade! Sure, I'll recall out. *recall* *leave party*

Wow...

Zenako
08-08-2007, 11:32 AM
Keep your eye out for the various "Remove X" wands. My cleric has a bank of wands for things like that, which frees up spell slots for more interesting choices.

You can get: Remove Blindness, Remove Paralysis (slow spell), Remove Disease, Remove Curse, etc wands. Most of these are being cast on the reactive mode so the lower duration of the effect from the wand versus the caster is a non issue. I also carry along wands of Lesser Restoration, Neutralize Poison, Holy Smite, and the normal Healing stuff.

If you see someone in the party pull one from a chest with a character that could not use it, ask if you could have it. 9 times out of 10, they will just give things like that to a caster, since the resale value of it is peanuts compared to the worth of the effects once triggered.

JayDubya
08-08-2007, 11:36 AM
There have been times when the group has proposed doing "X" and I'll say "Sorry guys, I can't afford the wandage. Would you like me to drop group?"

Most likely they'll give you money or wands. If not, drop group, and find another.

Also, this is the first time you've gone shopping, so you didn't know what to expect vis-a-vis cost. If, in the future, things start going badly, say "I'm out of mana, and this is my first character - I can't afford nice wands."

You're not asking money from them, you're stating a fact. As Impaqt said, what they do with that info is up to them.

llevenbaxx
08-08-2007, 12:45 PM
A simple thing I do is let people know im getting real low on sps. I know they can see the the bar and all but for some reason actually telling them makes them play more cautiously. Theres really no good reason for anyone to get pounded except maybe by named bosses.

Or: If players want to adopt the blitzkrieg warfare tactics, try being a little more proactive. Soundburst and command can save you bundles of cure spells when used wisely. Just some food for thought.

Like everyone else said too, if a group is getting creamed and in need of healing above and beyond the average, they know. Most will have no prob helping out with the fundage. NEVER recall out for sps at someone elses request... unless its to drop group. They are as responsible as you for having no sp left and should have to deal accordingly.:)

Strakeln
08-08-2007, 01:18 PM
Yeah, recalling out for mana is something you do when you're capped, not when you're trying to level.

Aspenor
08-08-2007, 01:23 PM
Yeah, recalling out for mana is something you do when you're capped, not when you're trying to level.

No doubt. If some gimp barbarian with delusions of uberness told my lowbie to recall out for mana, he'd suffer three consequeces:
1. No healing for the remainder of the quest. Guzzle your pots, cheapskate.
2. He will be watching from my pocket once he has died.
3. I will be dropping group the moment I have left the instance, closing with: "Good luck finding yourself a slave cleric."

Zenako
08-08-2007, 01:44 PM
No doubt. If some gimp barbarian with delusions of uberness told my lowbie to recall out for mana, he'd suffer three consequeces:
1. No healing for the remainder of the quest. Guzzle your pots, cheapskate.
2. He will be watching from my pocket once he has died.
3. I will be dropping group the moment I have left the instance, closing with: "Good luck finding yourself a slave cleric."

Well one thing that I might do...is recall out for mana..head to a tavern and wait for clickies et al to reset. I might or might not chug some wine or juice while waiting. It can take a while for mana to regen. Stop by the marketplace or some vendors to sell off some of the useless stuff I picked up already to make space. Etc, and thus make sure to take my time getting back to the quest. The zergie will end up now taking a LOT longer to do the quest. It is amazing how much lag in places in the marketplace can slow you down.

I personally consider one recall to be about even to the expected death penalty the main melee's might be taking along the way so I will do it if I think it is really necessary to beat the quest. Do I like doing it. Nope. If it is going to take more than one recall to do...nope not worth it then, unless I am capped or capped on the quest anyway.

Hafeal
08-08-2007, 02:18 PM
My main is a cleric. I have to tell you, it takes some learning to get the ropes.
Other posts have touched on these as well:

1. You don't have to heal everyone to full the second they suffer damage, contrary to the demands of many, generally newer, melee types;
2. Pace your spells points (ask how many shrines there are so you have an idea of how to cast);
3. Max your spells with empower healing;
4. Heal during battle, wand heal after battle (can be a hard habit to create);
5. If you run low on wands, say something, the party usually has some on them or they will give a donation;
6. Allow "dumb" players to die. If you have a level 3 barb zerging in a level 5 quest on elite, I am in no haste to heal him/her. Even experienced players do this because they may be rushing to advance a character;
7. Be clear in battle in type or voice chat, when your party members are out of range - it is not your job to chase them, they can find you or, many times, they will heal themselves.

My experience has been mostly positive. I have had many donations, met many very experienced players who know how to take care of themselves (e.g., fighters who buy their own healing pits, remove curse, etc) and are relying on you to heal them in the heat of battle when they have been critted or to prevent a party wipe when things do not go as expected.

Sigmoid
08-08-2007, 02:22 PM
I have one rule for my cleric. I never let anyone talk me into entering a quest that is higher level than I am unless I have run it with some character and can judge how heavy it will be. Stand is probably the worst I can think of for being new to quest, low on level appropriate melee types, no thief, and barbarians who can't seem to understand that taking damage is their problem. I feel for you and have been there.

cridus
08-08-2007, 04:23 PM
again lots of fantastic replies.

Healing during combat and wand healing afterwards... in a long quest or a quest with very few/none shrines that makes very good sense. I have seen some people chugging back a pot after a battle when I already have then selected for my next heal, might wanna wait a few seconds after a battle to see who is drinking themselves, I don't usually top people to max unlesss it looks like they have more that a cure light wound in damage on them.

I like using divine healing to top people off, saves my sp, gives them a nice little regen. yes my turns would be better used for DV's I'm sure, but I also use my turns for divine cleansing after fighting some nasty spiders.

I guess I can add my own tip here to help conserve some sp, at the start of a quest I look at every characters info, I want to know what type of character they are, if I see a fighter/sorc I can expect them to run into melee so will require healing, wizzies are usually smart enough not to run in, but I was with a group earlier, he found a sunsword....whatever that is and then decided to melee for the next part of the tomb, he sucked up a bit of sp. ( but they donated 2 cure serious wands to me so I didn't really care) Also if I see a pure fighter I like to ask much hp he has, seeing as the party screen only shows there hp in bars not numbers, it can be hard to tell what type of heal to use. But knowing what is in the party I can tell if my fighter drops to mid hp it will require a cure serious, if my rogue drops to half hp its probably only a cure mod to heal it.

SqtYork
08-08-2007, 05:12 PM
there is a lot of great advice here, and some bone heads.

Most of my mains have always been clerics.

One thing I noticed pretty quickly is that you can proactively save your self a lot of SPs by casting fire resist on all the melee types. Sometimes it electric or cold or acid, but generally its fire for early levels. Cast poison neutralization on folks when you fighting spiders and scorpions. I didn't use a lot of wands until I was well into 9th+ level as a cleric.

In guild groups I am more than willing to use my own wands etc. But usually that's where I don't even have to ask. Someone hands a stack of scrolls, wands. Sometimes it happens in PUGs too. My rule of thumb was if they give me wands or money great I will use them and some of mine. If they don't then it's my choice not theirs. Tell folks the squishies to manage their aggro better, tell the tanks not to out run your healing.

Another thing I found was that with the right enhancements, devotion items, and potency items you find a sweet spot for healing. I would generally spam CMW and sometimes CLW. Point for point it was the most cost effective way to heal.

Lastly, clerics are not as common as some of the other classes. Most groups will happily put up with novice clerics. The problem is that most of the time being a good cleric means you don't do much more than watch health bars, buff, and do some crowd control. It's boring for most folks. If people in the group are making it a pain to play, tell them, and then if they don't really fix it, say thanks and drop the group at the end of the quest, or if it's bad enough during the quest.

MasterofDungeons
08-08-2007, 05:23 PM
I'm not a big fan of asking for handouts though, I'm going to try and carry a supply of wands but if I'm in a party like I was earlier, a lot of over aggro and needless damage I'm going to forget I have them, but if the team is working well together then I will certainly pull out my "wand of save butt" and start tossing the heals around like I'm Harry Potter.

If a teammate wants to toss me a few plats for keeping them standing then I don't look at that as panhandling, I look at it as services rendered. :)

Amen!

/cheers (with a drink, not that silly jumping emote)

Jaysensen
08-08-2007, 11:02 PM
twink barb was asking me to recall out

Thats horrible. He should have drank potions. Twink characters are supposed to have a pack of pots to remove status effects and heal themselves. Especially classes that cant use Divine Wands.

TreknaQudane
08-09-2007, 10:39 PM
From the sound of the quest you were probably in what... Gwylan's Stand?

Anyway, the problem lays not in you lacking wands or resources. Alot of people play ... recklessly and if you are in a group with reckless players, don't heal them. Or kindly (meanly works too) ask them to maybe not rush ahead or to use a shield. At level 6, you should be fine using your mana alone for heals if your group plays smart. A level 3 character in what was probably a level 7 quest is not smart.

Ziltus
08-09-2007, 11:37 PM
I can feel ya pain, my first char is a cleric too. I asked similar questions when I returned to DDO during mod 4 launch after several MIA from the games, as a L12 clr back then.

Clr can be an expensive class to play, but when mana is out, it's out. The grp has to decide what they want - to pay u to get more wands or pass u wand, otherwise everyone will have to teleport out to get their HP/mana etc.

My 2nd char is a pally, he occasionally do L14 & higher in grp w/o cleric but he always keep 1-2 stacks of CSW pots and 4-6 CSW wands. Even with a clr around I always do my own self buffing (eg resis, DW, false life/gtr heroism/etc using clickies) and self-heal during off combat. It's can be expensive too but definitely much better than my clr who carries 1-2 stacks of 100 heal scrolls, plenty of CSW wands and 100 CSW pots (for self healing during GH raid floating sessions).

For a start, you got no choice but to ask grp for donation, either that or the whole grp slow down the pace to minimise healing. Try to leave the buffing to other classes like pally, sor/wiz, rng and bard. Do pick up the healing improvement feats and enhancements like empower healing, life magic etc ASAP instead of spliting into other things (tat's if u wanna play a healing clr like me). Try to get some devotion items will help ya healing efficiency too, esp greater/superior devotion 1H, they can be easily found in Ah at reasonable price.

Worst case, stop playing ya clr and built another low-maintenance class first, eg sor, pally. Lvl them up to earn more $$$ to PL ya cleric. :o

geoffhanna
08-09-2007, 11:46 PM
I am never offended by a cleric asking if anyone wants to pool plat for wand purchase (or res scroll purchase). And when asked, I do.

I volunteer plat too, except often I forget. I don't mind the reminder at all.

barghest
08-09-2007, 11:49 PM
ask and ye shall recieve:):D

Cowdenicus
08-10-2007, 01:51 AM
Just some tips as I have 2 clerics, one capped and I have a few extra gold pieces in my bank. Take them and apply them as you see fit.

Divine healing is a underrated enhancement, switch out for it if need be, it will save you alot of spell points until later on in the game (I know some clerics that love it enough to keep it all the time).

MAx out your wisdom, for a cleric Wisdom is your main stat. Wisdom = spell points.

You play in a way that is fun for YOU. This is a game.

If you are a new player, let people know. Not only may they hand you gear or cash, they will be alot more likely to explain things, and help you out. (we were all new once, well except for me but that is because I am the Uber :eek: )

As a cleric, generally speaking an ounce of prevention is worth a POUND of cure.

Otherwise there has been some great advice. If you play on the new Ghallanda let me know. I can help you out, as I am constantly rerolling characters.

DemonMage
08-10-2007, 02:13 AM
Divine healing is a underrated enhancement, switch out for it if need be, it will save you alot of spell points until later on in the game (I know some clerics that love it enough to keep it all the time).


Very much yes. If you've got a somewhat resonable amount of turns, this winds up being a huge amount of helpful healing available to you, at least up until you've got Heal. It also doesn't need LoS, great when your party separates a bit for one reason or another.

It starts to be a little less useful later on with the advent of Heal, and the more powerful potency scepters being readily available to freely boost your heals, and as you get more money and don't mind throwing money at the problem =-p Highly recommended for being new.

oronisi
08-10-2007, 09:10 AM
Hold the F-ing phone...why are we even commenting on this?! The OP said that he was lvl 5, the leader was a lvl 3, and they were doing a lvl 7 quest.....

No #)%*% it's going to be an expensive quest. What do you think the levels are on the quests to begin with??

DemonMage
08-10-2007, 09:20 AM
You make a compelling point. Gogo skimming.

weyoun
08-10-2007, 10:06 AM
The true advice for a newcomer to DDO (at this late stage) is never roll a cleric for your first character.

Roll a sorceror or perhaps a paladin -- someone with low operating costs and good income potential. Get to 14, rack up some wealth, and then roll a cleric.

No one wants to rely on handouts from the party. No one wants to feel like he let the party down. The solution is to get cash, then roll the cleric.

/gren

This is the best advice given here yet. I started with a cleric, and then rerolled him for another cleric once I reached drow. Big mistake, took me a long time to accumulate any wealth, I was capped at level 12 for months before I broke 500k plat. Now my first cleric is gone, second cleric is my main, who only comes out to raid. Anyway, get you 400 favor with the cleric so you can unlock drow. Roll a drow sorc, as Grenfell says and then stop playing your original cleric. Save him for times when you can't find a group.

If you don't like this advice then you gotta ask for money bro.

weyoun
08-10-2007, 10:15 AM
Since I am a new player I don't really know what to expect in a given quest, so because of this I like to have all my remove spells available, after I know the quests a bit I can certainly change my spells around, "sound burst" seems like a very handy spell, I could fit in "command" but as it is single target, I find there is better places to put my SP, I will probably start toting around "prayer" though as that spells really does help parties out.


Remove curse/blindness etc are nice but your party members, especially if they're not new players, should carry all of their own restoratives. If you are in a big fight you will want to pull the curse/blindness off the main tank(s), but everyone else needs to take care of that themselves, as well as heal themselves between fights. If they don't have the restoratives let them walk around a while feeling the pain, as it were. There's no excuse for veteran players who aren't self-sufficient.

Edit: And don't heal stupidity. If there is a rogue in the party and folks are running through traps. Just tell them, "I don't heal stupidity." You'll be suprised how their health bars are restored to full . . . its almost as if, they had pots or wands or something.

weyoun
08-10-2007, 10:34 AM
The problem is that most of the time being a good cleric means you don't do much more than watch health bars, buff, and do some crowd control. It's boring for most folks.

My main (cleric) is commonly out front with destruction and GC (no melee please). If it starts getting thick you just drop back and let the tanks DPS and then you heal. You can run around destruct/slay like a sorceror with FoD. GC is one of the best CC spells in the game. I'll run through GC ing everything and SL / Destruct the stuff that saves. Fighters just follow and clean up on the prone mobs. Nobody ever complains, and I spend only about 20-40% of my mana on healing. It makes clericing a whole lot more fun than "watching health bars."

Roguewiz
08-10-2007, 12:13 PM
I was in a group, about 1 week after I returned to the game. I was in a group with 3 warfored, but no Arcane Cleric (cough..wizard). The group asked if anyone had an UMD high enough to use Repair Serious Wands. I chime in, I do. They ask me to go get some. I explain to them that I just returned and that I only had 4kpp to my name.

They took a collection and gave me 30kpp. They said to buy a few Cure Serious and Repair Serious Wands. Was quite nice of them actually, I didn't even ask for it.

30kpp and a 37 haggle go a long way ;)

Granted, not every group would be this nice. Best thing to do is explain to them your situation, who knows, you might strike plat.

(On a side note: I kept the toasters and the other fleshies up with the wands I bought)

cridus
08-10-2007, 06:07 PM
Yeah I am aware the quest was lvl 7 and I was only vl 5 and the quest leader was lvl 3, I checked out the remainder of the team and they were all 5's and 6's plus we were running the quest on normal. Also remember I'm new and not too familiar with the quest levels ( I always read that now when entering quests)
I guess lessoned learned. I've run a nice few quests, still a noob, I still tell people that I'm new to the game only a week in. A lot of people have been generous to me either tossing me some plat or handing over some wands. Thanks to the plat I was given I was able to get the status effect removing wands, (lesser restoration, remove paralysis, etc) so now I'm about to carry some of the combat spells, I have to say that Soundburst seems to have saved me a nice amount of sp, for the little 15 sp it costs to cast it if 2 out of the 5 mobs fail there save it can stop flanking and therefore stop incoming damage.

Curently I'm at lvl 6.2 now, with 440 sp, thanks to a few handouts, I'm able to keep a stack of wands availible for those just in case moments, I'm not tossing Cure Light Wounds all the time to top up after a battle, usually I find after 1-2 battles if I'm not topping up with CLW, miraculously I can see there hp going up, guess the party isn't depending on me so much and will use there only supplies to top off.

I like have the wands and readily whip them out, when I run out of sp and the battle is going heavy. I'm happy to say that I have stopped many a team wipe from happening because I carry them.

I don't have a huge stash of them of course (1CLW, 2CMW,3CSW wands) but this should last me a nice bit anyways. Plus of course the status wands so I can have other spells readily availible suchs as buffs and stuff.

I'm learning as I'm going along, heck I almost got my drow unlocked with the quests I've been running. And I'm looking for that devotion gear, I have an okay devotion II scepter, but I like attacking too and it's not very good for swinging. Need to run tangleroot I guess to try for that devotion ring or that stone I see people posting about.

Keep all the pointers coming though, as I'm sure since this has been helping me out, it will help other new clerics, And I know that when I'm considered a senior and I've moved on to a different character to carry a wand to donate to a new cleric.

Thanks again for all the great advice, this is a fantastic game, with a great community, going to be here a while I think, looking forward to when I'm high enough to try those raids I see spamming in big white letters on my screen every now and then too.

Hvymetal
08-11-2007, 07:09 AM
Hopefully non-clerics can give advice? :)

You are getting to the levels where Pallys & Rangers can cast resist, let them do it if possible. A lot might hold out (I know I like to hold on to some of my mana on my pally's for Divine Favor but if it helps the group out) if they don't like it they can suck it up. Remember a lot of classes can buff and a well buffed party can severly cut down on the mana you spend.

Even more dramatically a party that uses tactics and crowd controll will really reduce the amount of healing required.

P.S. You shoulda told the barb to recall out and get some HP :)

P.S.S On an aside (and this comes from someone that plays melees/rogues) why is it that when things go badly often times most the tanks decide to hang around inside the instance dead? It only requires 1 person to hold an instance I see this happen way more often than it should...

Rissten
08-11-2007, 08:58 AM
Another thing that could be useful to you also is if you have a sorc or a bard in the group they usally have a high haggle (mine has a 16 at level 7) which means they get things cheaper. I don't know what kind of pugs you have been running with though and I'm just making a guess. It doesn't sound like you are running with people who have capped toons more like people who buy plat from plat farmers, cause everyone I have pugged with that has a capped toon knows how much clerics spend on wands and scrolls and almost always give the cleric insane amounts of plat. matter of fact to other day I gave a cleric (his first toon) 20K plat and a helm of the silver flame which I had on my cleric at one time.

Krow
08-11-2007, 09:39 AM
Thanks again for all the great advice, this is a fantastic game, with a great community, going to be here a while I think, looking forward to when I'm high enough to try those raids I see spamming in big white letters on my screen every now and then too.


I applaud your determination to continue with your Cleric. Especially being your 1st character. I am sure you will be, and it seems so in your posts, another great and reliable Cleric. Some say they don't need you, and others can't live without you.

It takes certain types of players to actually enjoy and want the burden of the healer. It is a great challenge to multi-task, and keep the party alive as well as your self.

A couple of pointers on the top of my mind...

1- Never feel its your fault when things go badly.
2- Don't chase after anyone to heal(could put yourself in danger). If they don't know enough by now to stay in your range, or return to you, let them suffer their fate. They will tire of dying soon enough.
3- Buffing resists/poison/disease etc. save you more sp overall. Also you can and should occasionally remind the party to equip proper immune items if they have any. And don't be afraid to ask what you need for certain encounters/quests.
4- Make sure you have your self covered. Meaning-useful armor, weapons, scepters/clubs, etc. Resists and buffs. If you go down, usually everyone follows.
5- Rangers, some rogues, Paladins and Bards can heal and buff as well. Ask them if they could assist.(this is where IMO, DV's can be very useful).

If you feel that your group is lacking or just plain horrid, you can choose to finish then drop. Or stick it out, and let them know that you are out of sp's/wands/potions. And never feel obligated to recall unless YOU want to. Those who are determined to finish the quest usually cough up a unmentioned wand or sp potion. Or they may decide to make a run for supplies.
Anyhooos.......everybody loves a good Cleric. You will sometimes be complimented for your efforts. Also you will be remembered for your determination and saving grace when death seems certain.

Good luck to you......!(sorry for rambling on ;P)

Deusxmachina
08-11-2007, 01:38 PM
5- Rangers, some rogues, Paladins and Bards can heal and buff as well. Ask them if they could assist.(this is where IMO, DV's can be very useful).


Yep, a great thing is when others buff people at the start then the cleric DVs them back right away. The others don't get annoyed for having to spend so much sp, and the cleric doesn't have to spend any sp, although he does need the enhancements, of course. People often expect a wizard or cleric to buff them with everything under the sun, and then he winds up with only half his mana left one minute after starting the instance.

I see a lot of paladins not buffing anyone. No resists, no Virtue even on the squishy guy so he doesn't get one-shotted, and then they don't even cast buffs on themselves while asking for others' buffs. And here I thought paladins were supposed to be nice, church-going people who help others.

And, yeah, I learned a lesson early on with my cleric: "I don't chase." If someone runs way ahead and leaves me behind, often to get partly lost, I assume they are capable players and don't need my clerical assistance. And then I hear the cries of, "Heal me! Heal me! How come I'm not getting heals!" when I'm not even in the same room as them and then see one or both of us may have misjudged the capabality of their character.

Crud
08-11-2007, 01:43 PM
Heheh, got that exact setup about 5 days ago when a fighter ran way ahead (got to keep up the kill count ya know) and ran right into a nasty force trap. I would have put some healing on him if he weren't 1000 yards beyond my range. He started yelling, "HEALME, HEALME!!" as he died. He left the party without another word as soon as I rezzed him.

Cowdenicus
08-11-2007, 05:31 PM
Heheh, got that exact setup about 5 days ago when a fighter ran way ahead (got to keep up the kill count ya know) and ran right into a nasty force trap. I would have put some healing on him if he weren't 1000 yards beyond my range. He started yelling, "HEALME, HEALME!!" as he died. He left the party without another word as soon as I rezzed him.

hope you put him on a list.

Dkmafia
08-13-2007, 08:40 AM
Since I'm a new player, I don't have a high level toon funneling gold to my support cleric. I'm only lvl 5 as well but I have teamed a lot and haven't really bought anything. Everything I wear is stuff I found. So I've built up about 40k gold. Well recently I was in a party that didn't go so well, it was a lvl 7 quest in house P and there were a ton of traps all over the place, the team had no rogue and the team leader was only a lvl 3 barbarian. (Holla for PUG's) Now the Barb must of had a high level toon funneling him some cash cause he was still tearing through all the trolls and bugbears so I guess he had a nice weapon. Problem is since he was only lvl 3 he was taking hordes and hordes of damage. Now as support cleric I pride myself in the fact that I was able to keep him on his feet. We also have a lvl 6 pure fighter who had well over 100 HP. Well needless to say I easily was blowing through all my SP in about 2 encounters. So now I'm basically a fighter, as I have no SP to cast my spells.

First thing that the party asks me is "do you have any wands?"
Well i had a wand of cure light wounds ( not much help and that was empty in no time )
So after the quest I ask where I can get some wands. and I get directed to the bazaar, so I head off on my quest to purchase some wands.

I find the bazaar easily enough, after about 10 minutes of strolling around the bazaar I finally find the wand seller. Why he is all the way up there is beyond me but I digress.
I scroll through his list of wands and find what I'm looking for, a "wand of cure moderate wounds."
50 charges , that oughta help keep a party alive....then I look at the price tag.......what are people on teams nuts, they want me to shell out 5k for a wand to use on them to keep them alive. Now don't get me wrong I bought 3, but these are only going to be used in dire circumstances, those 3 wands cost me 15k+ gold, but if I'm running say tangleroot. (did it last night, very long but fun) I know that I would have blown through at least 1 of those wands if I had it on me.
What I'm inquiring is I am a support cleric, do most teams expect me to bust out my wand when I have no SP to keep them alive all the time. I won't be able to save up any gold if all teams expect that.

Is there anyway to avoid going broke as a support cleric???

Well sadly, yes. This is whats expected of you. There was a time when people avoided taking damage. But now it's a race. I would suggest two things:

1. They wanna zerg, make them pay for it. Please don't be one of these poor clerics that just take it quietly. I read that you dont wanna beg, but trust me, not only is it common practice, it will be your life blood.

2. Yell at them. People know when they are taking damage and just like children will continue until they are "caught". You will amazed at the ability of these people to avoid all damage if you put them on heal rations.

I also wanna say after reading through this, you sound like you are/are going to be a great cleric .. GL man

Zenako
08-13-2007, 09:26 AM
Sounds like you have gotten past the first real hurdle of being an effective cleric. Obtaining the state of mind and wisdom to know that you are the Cleric, not the babysitter. That you can pull people's bacon out of the fire, but that the fire will not hurt so much with a nice Fire Resist on it to start with.

Regarding Rangers/Palys and Bard. Unlike normal PnP D&D, all of those characters get FULL level benefits when casting spells, so a 7th level Ranger or Paly get 20 point resists (30 at 11th), just like the Cleric spell, there is no 2 for 1 level counting going on so no loss in effectiveness. Rangers should be casting Barkskins on a few party members who expect to get into combat at least.

All of my casters carry with them some High POWER or MAGI item (usually a weapon or Robe) that they start every quest with. They use this bonus spell points to cast buffs and then switch to normal gear. My Paly has over 400 spell points at the begining each time (with 50 SP to burn right away) That is 3 or 4 30 point elemental resists, or a Magic Circle vs Evil (helps stop mind control and other attacks). Ranger with cast Barkskins on all. Both also have some healing spells focused and will cast them as needed. My Bard is a Buffing machine (as many are) and can heal almost as well as a cleric at this point with the use of some scrolls for the spells not on my list.

Haggle will be your friend. Try to keep and use the maximum Haggle boost item you find. You only need to pop it on when buying and selling. Also boost your CHA to it best when buying and selling things since Haggle is a CHA based skill.

My cleric will DV up Semi Casters (Rangers and Palys) if I see them dropping down resists or other buffs. They are often the backup healers in the group and someone who can save my bacon if I start to sizzle.

Just curious, which server are you on?

cridus
08-13-2007, 10:22 AM
Wow more great advice, it's all really helping. I tried to step into the lines recently. Not much in the way of weapons, a +3 Heavy Mace and a +1 Shocking Heavy Mace (something like that). I do okay in the battle, but sometimes I miss critical heals because of it and some team mates have died. Guess I should stick back and play bodyguard for the casters, I can get a good view of the battle field from there and heal when required.

Setting up my hotkeys and shortcuts bars is taking a lot of efford, currently I have 5 bars. 1 for my main in combat spells, this is also my active bar. One is my clickies, some of my switchable gear, mostly necklaces. 1 is buffs, and the last one is a bar full of my wands, I'm sure I will end with a lot more, now to find spots on my screen for them, still got the right side of screen available lol.

I'm currently lvl 7 so I have started toting around a few raise dead scrolls. Not many though as they are 7k gold a pop.

I did get lucky recently and found some nice fullplate with devotion III on it, my cure serious wounds hits for about the same as cure critical now. Still looking for a few half decent weapons. Just before the server went down I found a Chaos Band, looks pretty good might net me a few gold pieces to put towards my supplies.

Seeing as how I don't beg for handouts although people have still given me a few wands and scrolls every now and then, only sitting at 10k plat. But it is enough to repair and restock as necessary.

Thanks for all the great advice I check on this thread all the time. Really good pointers for a new cleric, keep em coming, might need the tips to pick you guys up in battle some day. :)

Zenako
08-13-2007, 10:47 AM
Few quick things about dynamic play.

You may already know these things, but if you don't they can help a lot.

You can select party members using the F1-F6 keys. You are always F1. See the third member on your party list going down, hit F3 and then hit the hotkey for the healing spell/effect. Often quicker than trying to select the character on the screen or moving the mouse up to select on the name.

With a few good hotkey setups, you can run through party names with your left hand and be dropping down heals from different timers on with other fingers. I try to keep the slots for the healing spells in the first few slots of the hot bar. Look at the keyboard. Hit F3 and then 4 for the fourth slot on your active hotbar to cure the character, they need more, then 5. I also slot a healing wand or two nearby as well. This makes it possible to moveup into the fight and swing away, and quickly turn to healing if needed. Since it is likely if you are helping that you are not doing enough damage to win agro from the mobs, not too many will be return attacking you. I have often run Hennako right up into the middle of things and used that central vantage point to control the health of the battle field. Dropping a Soundburst or Holy Smite down on selected mobs can be effective for the shift in fortune of a battle they bring and by being up front, you can avoid being blocked as much.

If you have Divine Healing enhancement, learn which types of toons benefit the most from it. Often it is the squishie types who are getting aggro from their spells. They will have fewer HP so the DH is a bigger boon to them, and can keep them from being taken incap, and will soon bring them back if not dead. If the party has no bard or Morale type bonuses, do not forget Bless and Prayer and later on Recitation. They all help.

Most of my high level toons have 10 hotbars on screen at all times these days. It can get crowded, but if your hardware can handle it, up the pixel count on screen, and since the Hotbars are a pixed size overlay, they all get smaller. I can fit two rows of 4 and the chat window along the bottom. I have two other hot bars up at the top of the screen on the left center. I want to leave as much left to right of the screen open since most action is horizontal in nature and not vertical.

muffinlad
08-13-2007, 06:55 PM
.
DO NOT accept somebody telling you: "it's cheaper for you to heal me" because that is not the issue. Next time tell him to buy some pots, or get get used to running around with 1/3 life.


Good god, I hate when people say "that is cheaper for you to heal me"....it really lights me up. Each one of my toons carries at least 50 heal pots and/or wands. Everyone MUST be responsible for their health, first and foremost.

Having a healing cleric with you is a blessing, not a requirement.

If you think this behavior is annoying at 3rd level, wait until you see it from people at 14th.....

muffinlad

arminius
08-14-2007, 11:31 AM
The true advice for a newcomer to DDO (at this late stage) is never roll a cleric for your first character.

Roll a sorceror or perhaps a paladin -- someone with low operating costs and good income potential. Get to 14, rack up some wealth, and then roll a cleric.

No one wants to rely on handouts from the party. No one wants to feel like he let the party down. The solution is to get cash, then roll the cleric.

/gren

Gren is on the money here, so to speak.

This path might conflict with, say, a fast favor goal (i.e. the best character to get to 400 or 1750 favor as fast as possible is a support cleric), but if the character runs out of money he isn't going to get much favor anyway.

Cap a Sugar Daddy Paladin with max haggle, and then have your lowbie Cleric hit up his wallet till he squeals.

_

amysrevenge
08-14-2007, 01:40 PM
Regarding hotbar setup, one thing I have done that really helps is:

I remapped hotbar slots 8,9,0 to keys H,G,F (because each command can have two keys, they work with either the original number or the new letter, not just the new letter).

That way, not only do you have hotbar slots 1,2,3,4 right above your fingers, you have 8,9,0 right next to your fingers. I put the thing I use the most or need the most quickly on the F/0 key (trip on my fighter, LoH on my pally, Charm Person on my Sor, CMW on my cleric, etc), and the next most important things in slots 1, 2, 3, 4, G/9, H/8.

Things like buffs, resists, removeX, I put in other bars in other slots. You have leisure to click them as you need them.

Mike

CoolHand_Luke
08-15-2007, 02:34 PM
Control the party is the best way to conserve consumable resources.

Me... I have a supportive guild, and Those "Rich Uncles" that set up trust funds for my cleric. My style = expensive. Don't play like me.

Control the zergers by healing them no more than half life. If they cry... tell them to:

1) deal with it, for they have no self control.
2) Go buy some armor.
2) Support their own play style (IE pony up AC 0 barb), or get some heal pots.
3) Tell then to suck it up, or kick you out and get another cleric. Most likely this wont happen. Look at the LFMs, most is looking for clerics.
4) understand that although it is an expensive class, clerics are invited to all the parties. They get their favor fast. And others need you more than you need them.
5) Waiting for a group to get started is rare, for when you get there the party has started. Either you have completed it, or once others see a cleric has already joined, others join quick.
6) Never under estimate the power of life / death. It truly is in your hands.

And yes/ I know clerics are not "necessary", but they sure make things go alot easier.

I applaud you choice of being a healer to start with. The game and all servers need more, and no, you are not expected to go broke.

Beherit_Baphomar
08-15-2007, 03:59 PM
This is a kinda old thread, but I like to throw my two coppers in every once in a while.

OP!!! Listen up bro.

Tell people you are new to the game. You can tell who in your party is twinked, and that means they have cash. More than you do.
I recently created a character on Risia, and let me tell ya its hard not having cash to start off with.
Most of us will be more than happy to hand you a few 'k' to help out with a quest.

And that zerging, level 3 barbarian who has no idea what he's doing, tell him to buy pots. TELL HIM.
Levelling my barbarian was thee most expensive thing Ive ever done so far in DDO. I was going throo healing pots like they were going out of fashion.

Lil story for ya. Levelling my barb and I was running STK, well the group leader is zerging ahead, he had a well-know guild name above his head. Zerg/HJEAL ME/Zerg/HJEAL ME/Zerg/RESTORE ME/Zerg/HJEAL ME. I got so sick of this I had to say something to him...that poor cleric...restore pots can be bought, heal pots can most defo be bought.

Heal during fights Mr.OP, and wait to see who is using pots after fights and who isnt. Those who dont, say something to them, those who do, help them out a lil with some wand charges and explain to them you are a newb.

What server are you on? I know Argo gets ALOT of...shall we say...less-desirable noobs at low levels, and even at high levels after the 50% XP weekends.

One last thing;
Just as you have come here for advice others need advice too.
When I was new to this game I didnt know squat. I asked questions, I watched, I investigated. Some people just dont know. You have to tell them they can buy restore pots, you have to tell them wands cost money, you have to tell them they can heal themselves after fights. Just do it in a nice way.

binnsr
08-15-2007, 04:25 PM
In addition to the other good advice already dispensed here, I would recommend looking at your party makeup, then comparing it to the quest. A rule of thumb is the more levels between the average character-level and the level of the quest, the more chance that there will be 'issues' in completing the quest.

Most of the time, having a lvl3 barbarian advertising for a lvl7 quest is a recipe for disaster..

Draclaud
08-16-2007, 11:28 AM
Divine Healing can help save your SP, and wands. Up to about level 8 or so DH can be very usefull.

Zenako
08-16-2007, 11:41 AM
I still find DHIII useful at 14th level, when used the right way on the right characters.

Will it keep that mondo Barbarian topped off...probably not

Will it keep that skillful Rogue from needing to switch off to hit some pots along the way...good chance

Will it keep that Arcane or Bard free to do their thing a little better...good chance

Can it heal where other spells fear to tread...you betcha

cridus
08-16-2007, 07:48 PM
Well I have to say all the fantastic advice I've recieved from this post has helped a lot. Currently I'm lvl 8, 2 ranks from lvl 9. I'm always in a party never hard to get one. And whenever I leave a party I always get tells from another party looking for a cleric. I tell people I'm new, even added it to my bio so people can see. But recently I've had a few people say they didn't believe I was very new due to how well I was performing (not tooting my own horn or nothing but that made me feel good.)

My cash in pocket is still pretty low only a little over 14k plat, but thanks to all the teams running big quests I currently have about 8-10 items sitting on the AH hoping they sell.

I don't always get something given too me, but it does happen, a lot of people hand over those mana pots, which I use if needed. I've been given a couple of cure serious wands, maybe 3-4 or so. But usually someone is kind enough to give me about 2-3k plat, which allows me to keep a nice stock of wands and raise dead scrolls. I like to carry about 4 cure serious wands, 2 cure mods for top ups and 5 raise dead scrolls. Of course I don't use them all the time, as I've found that a well placed command or soundburst can save me a lot more SP's.

Like I said I don't have a lot of cash in pocket, usually enough to keep my supplies stocked. I haven't looked at buying anything off the AH as my money could go to better things.

I have recently completed my first raid, did the Tempest Spine. Got a nice cloak of protection +3 which I can't use until I hit 9, and a nice Shining Adamantine Plate. My weapons still need some work as the ones I have are a +1 shocking heavy mace of shattermantle, and a +1 icyburst heavy mace of slowburst I think. They aren't much but I can stay by the casters and help protect them.

I know I'm still a noob, today is the 2 week mark, I've run headlong into unknown traps, got smoked by falling to my doom even took a swim in lava (not recommended). But when I hear that I'm doing well from a party member that always makes me feel good.

If anyone is looking for a support cleric, I'm on Argos, if I'm not currently in a party I'll run any quest, they are all new to me....except Hidden in Plain Sight, that quest is just insane, and a huge drain on my resources.

jaitee
08-17-2007, 04:10 AM
lol what you need to do is tell people straight up, for example, i was on my warchanter a.k.a battle bard, and i joined this group

soon i got a tell saying can you be our main healer, i was like nope, im a battle bard, ill heal when necessary, and battle when necessary, but i will not be healing like a cleric will be

soo soon, we are running necro thrall on elite, and the group fills up, and BAM! no cleric, no casters!! all fighters in the group

i sent a tell to the leader, are you crazy? and hes like can you just heal some, ill help out too, so these people are like, if we dont run this on elite then its pointless, etc.

so i said, we dont have a cleric, and 1 of the fighter goes, dont worry about me, i have pots, and the rest remains silent, so i mentioned lets go on hard or normal, and they wanted to do elite, so i said remember im not a cleric i wont be healing like a cleric..

so we get inside, and soon most of them are limping at 5-20 hp, thinking, we have a bard he will wand heal us!!!!!

and did i heal them? yes some, but im not going to use 3 CSW wands on people in the group

not a team player? yes of course we are, but...

you have to remember, people these days, want a cleric, to just heal and at all cost heal

remember that MOST people wont care about you, or the supplies you are using

remember, that people are allowed to buy potions, so dont even heal them if they are just running around not drinking potions

everyone, poor or not, should have their own potions to heal with

its not your job anymore to cleric, when you are out of spell points, just remember that, anything else you do dealing with supplies is out of sympathy

when you are out of spell points, you either stand around and wait for a shrine if your a heal bot, or if your a real cleric go fight

the point is, if you see people not even healing themselves, at all, then tell them straight up, do you not have pots? why dont you have pots? go buy potions etc.


just my advice to you, ive played my fair share of a cleric, and being straight forward, helps alot, it may sound like you are mean, but its the facts

you are healing with you plat, people should be healing with their plat aswell

alot of times people will think clerics without massive supplies are bad clerics, but its only because people are too greedy to self heal

Mizyrlou
08-17-2007, 10:00 AM
With a cleric main, I can easily say it's rough at times for playing the class.

I've been in groups where all they expected me to do was stay in the back and heal, been in insanely zerging groups that were screaming for 'hjeel' while I'm still trying to catch up from 3 rooms back, been broke more times than I can count.

Once I started running with a steady group of people, that changed. I knew what their capabilities were for more efficient healing, and they knew what I could handle. The occasional donation of plat or wands was always greatfully accepted since I never ask.

A good group knows what it's like being the cleric and dealing with some of the doofs out there.

Deusxmachina
08-17-2007, 05:41 PM
soo soon, we are running necro thrall on elite, and the group fills up, and BAM! no cleric, no casters!! all fighters in the group


Heh, fighters and a bard is one of my favorite group compositions since things tend to die so fast through sheer DPS they don't have much time to hurt anyone. Unless the fighters are sucky.

Blazer
08-17-2007, 05:59 PM
Well I have to say all the fantastic advice I've recieved from this post has helped a lot. Currently I'm lvl 8, 2 ranks from lvl 9.

*snip*

If anyone is looking for a support cleric, I'm on Argos, if I'm not currently in a party I'll run any quest, they are all new to me....except Hidden in Plain Sight, that quest is just insane, and a huge drain on my resources.

Hiding in Plain Sight is a level 10 quest, so for an ill-prepared group yes, it is a drain on your resources, especially since you're only lvl 8. I'm hoping you only went in there on normal and were level 8 (not 7 - gulp!).

Cleric-ing gets easier IMO the higher levels you get. More spell points, more powerful spells, mass healing abilities coupled with better healing equipment buffers (read: greater devotion or potency 5 and 6 items, etc). Also, the party's DPS starts to ramp up around lvl 9-11ish as everyone is getting access to Improved Critical feats and barbs get Crit Rage I (lvl 11). And let's not forget you get Raise Dead and Slay Living at level 9 - good times!

Clerics rock, keep cruising along man.

cridus
08-17-2007, 06:41 PM
yeah Hidden in plain sight is a lvl 10 quest, and I'm only lvl 8. but I've run a nice few quests that were a lvl or 2 higher and sometimes hardly break out a wand. But with HiPS there is a ton of traps, that swimming hole is no picnic. Not to mention the end boss with his unlimited sp constantly healing himself while still swinging his weapon....wish I could do that.

I don't consider myself a healbot anymore. I can fight, I take a bit more damage than a frontliner but I can take stuff down, thanks to some of my spells. Currently 550 sp, opening a quest I have Mass Shield of Faith and Mass Aid for my 2 AoE buffs, plus a bull strength for the frontline. Also have Owl's Wisdom to increase the effectiveness of my offensive spells. and I have nightshield to protect myself a little. The majority of my spells are now in combat buffs such as recitation, soundburst and command. Almost all of my preventative spells are now in wand form.

Currently I have 2 hotbars for wands, even have soundburst in wand form for those times I run out of sp and we need some CC. I have taken the enhancement to improve my wand wiping so far its level 2. I have one of my inventory bags completely filled with wands. Now of course most I purchased myself, the remove curse and such as they are 500 plat only and I can afford those, especially since I haven't needed to replace any of them since I got them except the lesser restore one once. Currently carrying about 8 cure serious wands, 2 cure mods, and 2 cure lights for top ups as well. Most of my healing wands were donated to me. So currently I have no problems at all whiping it out when needed as I technically don't pay as much anymore. Earlier today I started Delara's Tomb and the team fighter gave me 3 CSW wands. I used maybe 4 charges. But thanks to the generous fighter, my next few teams will be greatful to him as well for his donation.

I'm not going to break any bank with my gold reserve, I can see that with my cleric, as I am constantly refilling my wands, and spell components. All my equipment is from quests, haven't bought a single thing except a +1club for slimes. But with my questing I am able to sustain a very nice collection of wands (one full inventory bag of wands I think is a nice collection) and scrolls, (will carry about 5 heal scrolls at 9 to remove that nasty feeblemind one of my teams experienced during TS.) I'll never be rich, but I am certainly enjoying everytime I step into my cleric's armor and face new monsters every day. Maybe one day I'll make a character that can make some gold, like a paladin, until then I'll continue wearing my quest rewards like they are, rewards.

Lorein_Azura_Childs
08-20-2007, 11:31 AM
Force group slowdowns by: Healing at the last minute (10% -20% health), this will take care of wreckless players.
If your running low, start slowing down the rate of healing, this does actually slow down the rushing a bit.
Ask for donations.
Dont join any groups you did not create is a viable option also, since your in demand just say no to anything you think will get you in over your head.
Suggest upfront that people should pick up items such as: Curse Removal, Blindness Removal, Reistance, or light/moderate cure potions at the lower levels if possible.
At later levels, crowd control can save you cash, spell points, and headaches.

Syrbryce
08-27-2007, 10:14 AM
One thing I have learned as a newbie cleric but with pimp-daddy lvl 14 fighters funding me, is you can really judge a group on the LFM page.

As with the lvl3 Barb running a lvl7 quest, some groups just look wrong on the LFM. A party that is all rangers and a rogue varient might be a little suspect.

You can also do a little research on the party leader. Put his name in the who list and see if he's a member of a guild and which guild. This may tell ya a little about who's running the show and if it's a guild group looking to fill up.

Guild groups filling up are my favorite since they usually know how each other play.

Strakeln
08-27-2007, 11:12 AM
I started my first cleric recently, and have been getting a real kick out of a few low level quirks. Usually I level up characters when guildies are doing the same, but this one has been PUG-ing his way up. As a result, sometimes the groups are what I'm used to... everyone has twinked 32-pt builds, all the potions and whatnot that they need.

Then, sometimes, you get the group full of new players. As I said, it's been a while since I ran low levels outside of guilded runs... so I've been somewhat shocked by the number of requests for curse removal from my level 3-4 cleric (can't cast or wand it til lvl 5).

Possibly the biggest indicator of who has done the low levels too many times before: the stack size of their curse removal and remove fear potions :D