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View Full Version : Do Rogues need Balance?



Cold_Stele
08-07-2007, 04:41 PM
I guess end-game a Rogue's Dex is 32 or higher, so that's a bonus of +11, without ever taking the skill.

My Fighters are on an end-game score of +8 or so and they seem to make most rolls to stand back up.

So my question is - do Rogues need the Balance skill at all or can they rely on their base Dex bonus?

I can fit in Haggle if I drop Balance...

Nitestalker
08-07-2007, 04:56 PM
Reason why melee usually gets up faster when knocked down, is becuase it is a STR check to get back up.

Blanace helps keep you from being knocked down. When/if my level 13 rogue gets knocked down (has a 31 in dex and max ranks in balance) he has a hard time getting back up and sometimes can take awhile.

Blazer
08-07-2007, 05:13 PM
Reason why melee usually gets up faster when knocked down, is becuase it is a STR check to get back up.

Blanace helps keep you from being knocked down. When/if my level 13 rogue gets knocked down (has a 31 in dex and max ranks in balance) he has a hard time getting back up and sometimes can take awhile.

You've got that backwards. Knockdown via trip/improved trip/whirlwind effect/etc is based off of your STR or DEX, whichever is higher. Balance is then used to see how quickly you get back up and on your feet.

Cold, my ranger has 32 DEX, never put a point into Balance, and if he gets knocked down, he gets right back up within 1-2 seconds. If you're going to be in the same DEX range, skip the points in Balance.

Nitestalker
08-07-2007, 05:41 PM
Hmmmm now i begin to wonder why it takes my rogue so long to stand back up.....hmmmmmm.

Blazer
08-07-2007, 05:47 PM
Hmmmm now i begin to wonder why it takes my rogue so long to stand back up.....hmmmmmm.

I dunno. With max ranks and a +10 modifier, your balance should be through the roof. I can't see you ever taking long to get back up, unless you are constantly surrounded by 3-4 dogs/worgs/wolves who like to spam trip one after the other. Ditto if you are getting knocked around by Air Elementals.

My ranger and fighter/paladin hybrid all have Balance scores of 10+ and get back up from a knockdown pretty quickly. My cleric, however, does not. :( Her balance is only around a 1 or 2.

Hafeal
08-07-2007, 05:47 PM
You've got that backwards. Knockdown via trip/improved trip/whirlwind effect/etc is based off of your STR or DEX, whichever is higher. Balance is then used to see how quickly you get back up and on your feet.

Cold, my ranger has 32 DEX, never put a point into Balance, and if he gets knocked down, he gets right back up within 1-2 seconds. If you're going to be in the same DEX range, skip the points in Balance.

This is correct. However, I believe several upcoming changes in Mod 5 will make putting points into balance more important. I would check out the dev update post as it has more I this as I recall.

Blazer
08-07-2007, 05:48 PM
This is correct. However, I believe several upcoming changes in Mod 5 will make putting points into balance more important. I would check out the dev update post as it has more I this as I recall.

Okies, will do.

EDIT: I just reviewed the current WDA and didn't see anything relating to Balance checks. Anywhere else I should look to find what you're talking about?

Hafeal
08-07-2007, 06:09 PM
Blazer -

Here is one recent thread that should be a good discussion for you:

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=116465&highlight=balance+tripped

I know I read something else about monster changes and the inference was that balance will be more important - it wasn't a blatant "You need this skill." :)

Blazer
08-07-2007, 06:27 PM
Well, all that thread showed me was that Balance is important...which I already knew. ;) No real info about any upcoming changes. Regardless, we both agree that Balance is an important skill. However, if a rogue is going to end up with 32+ DEX at level 14, making a significant investment in Balance may not really be needed.

That said, back to the OP. If you've got an extra skill point to burn per level, maybe don't invest fully in Haggle, maybe go half-n-half Haggle and Balance, sort of a future-proofing against any changes that make Balance more needed. For example, a new monster type that knocks you down and requires a very high Balance check to get back up.

Snike
08-08-2007, 12:12 AM
My rogue gets up very fast, but gets knocked down constantly. I really wish the knock down check was vs. balance.

Also it taking a long time to get up? You may be thinking of command, command and greater command own me.

Blind_Skwerl
08-08-2007, 01:40 AM
my sorcerer is typically running with a 10 dex and a 14 strength. My boots have +10 balance on them and I have put no skill points or enhancements into balance. I am usually back up on my feet in a second or two after being tripped.

Hvymetal
08-08-2007, 04:06 AM
The only thing that I am going to say is that it might not be a good idea to completely disregard Balance since we in fact have no way of knowing what changes are coming down the pipe in the future, a more well balanced (as in distribution not the skill :))build of character seems to weather change a little more effectively.

Might it not be possible to resist maxing haggle and settle on a compromise throwing a few points into balance along the way and giving up a few gold per transaction? Just a thought and my personal philosophy to making characters.