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View Full Version : Weekly Development Activities (June 25, 2007)



Samera
06-25-2007, 10:02 AM
In QA
These items are in QA and are scheduled for Update 4.2: Searing Heights.

General

Players get 3 more weapon set configuration slots, for a total of 7!
Fixed an Auction House bug where it was possible to bid on an auction and receive a different quantity of the item than expected.


UI Improvements

The XP bar should no longer disappear on larger monitors.
Mail

NEW – You will now get a warning (and won't be able to detach the money) when you attempt to detach money which would place you over the maximum amount of money you can have.

Auction House

You can now filter your auction house searches by item level. This search is based on the minimum level to use the item. Items with no level requirement are considered level 1 by the filter.
Clothing and Jewelry sections in the auction house are now broken up into multiple categories based the slot the item equips to. There are now a total of ten categories for both of these two sections. Note: Only newly posted auctions will appear in these new categories.

Friends List

Offline friends will no longer show up in the friends list when added or imported if "Hide Offline Friends" is checked.

NEW – Rogue Action Boost and Ranger Action Boost have new icons to differentiate them from Human Versatility.


Monsters

The spike damage of the Razor Cats is now working properly. Those who hit a razor cat in melee combat will have to make a reflex save or be injured by the spikes. Keep some throwing hammers and/or spearblock items handy.
The fire elemental's Aura of Flame has been fixed. It can no longer be blocked by spell resistance.
Duergar barbarians, bandits, and bards had their alignment corrected. They are now Neutral Evil instead of Lawful Evil.
Higher level wights and ghouls (CR 10 and above) will be able to use their innate abilities like level drain and disease on more of their attacks, rather than only doing these on their “rear back and jump forward” attack. This makes them more like their pen and paper counterparts and will make them a little more challenging. Players will of course still get their saves to resist these effects.


Combat

NEW – Weapons with special damage effects no longer cause a sneak attack on an unsuspecting victim to be lost.


Spells

NEW – Base cooldowns for Sorcerers reduced by 0.5 seconds for all spells (1.0 second for lingering effects.)
NEW – Maximize and Empower options temporarily removed from Fire Shield and Chill Shield - these metamagics were not increasing the amount of damage dealt by the spells but were increasing the spell point cost of the spells.
New Spell:

Holy Sword

Paladin 4
Channels holy power to turn a Blessed Cold Iron weapon into a +5 Holy Cold Iron weapon that grants its wielder a continuous Protection From Evil effect while equipped. The holy weapon is permanent, but is destroyed on dungeon exit.


Tenser's Transformation now grants Simple Weapon Proficiencies in addition to Martial Weapon Proficiencies. Additionally, casting Tenser's Transformation will now also grant proficiency with Throwing Hammers.
Chill Touch now (properly) has a fortitude save to negate the strength damage portion of the spell.
Potentially long-lasting debuff spells like crushing despair, bane, doom, and ray of enfeeblement have been changed so that they are removed by resting at a rest shrine.
Fixed Mind Fog's spell school. Mind Fog is an enchantment, not a conjuration.
The description for the Symbol of Flame spell has been fixed to accurately describe the amount of damage the spell does. The reflex save for this spell has also been fixed. Players and enemy npcs can now attempt a reflex save to reduce damage by half. The spell has always done 5d6 damage, and this has not been changed.


Skills, Feats, & Abilities

Reduced difficulty of detecting traps with Search and Spot, especially at low levels (5 and under).
The Power Critical feats have been upgraded. All of these feats have been consolidated into one. Once you have this feat, you will get a +4 bonus to confirm critical hits with any type of weapon.



Enhancements

The Toughness enhancement lines for dwarves, barbarians, fighters, and paladins have been upgraded. They now give you 5, 10, 15, and 20 additional hit points respectively instead of 5, 5, 5, and 5. They all still have the Toughness feat as a prerequisite.
NEW – Halfling Thrown Weapon Attack and Damage enhancements now work on Throwing Hammers.
NEW – Cleric and Paladin Unyielding Sovereignty now has significantly longer range (matching other healing spells) and requires line of sight to the target.
NEW – The active abilities under Rogue Specializations now show up underneath the passive ability rather than under a second heading.
NEW – Way of the Assassin now has three different poisons available for use: Thoughtburn (Int damage and prevents casting for a short time), Icechill (Dex damage and slows the target's attack speed for a short time), and Soulshatter (Lowers the target's spell resistance by 10 and Will saves by 4 for a short time). Only one poison may be active at a time.
Rogue Subtle Backstabber is now an active enhancement that has a toggled stance. While turned on, you will generate less hate on melee attacks.
The Silver Flame Exorcism enhancements now use 10 + (class level) + Charisma Modifier as a DC for the Will and Fortitude saves rather than a fixed save DC. Updated the descriptions to match.
An enemy poisoned by Thoughtburn (from the Way of the Assassin ability) now displays appropriate particle effects.
Undying Call now properly differentiates between Drow and "real" elves.
The various enhancements that summon creatures (Iron/Steel/Mithral Companion and Vulkoor’s Avatar) can now only be summoned in dungeons. You will no longer trigger the cooldown (and lose the attempt) if you try to summon them elsewhere. Summoning these creatures will now also break stealth.
Iron Companion no longer lists Cannith Repair II as a potential prerequisite, since a character with Cannith Repair II has already unlocked the enhancement through the Least Mark of Making.
NEW – Ranger Vermin Empathy enhancement prerequisites changed to: Ranger Level 2 (from 11). Ranger Extra Empathy I and any one of the following: Favored Enemy: Vermin, Ranger Desert Lore 2, Ranger Swamp Lore 2, or Ranger Extra Empathy IV.
NEW – Ranger Elemental Empathy enhancement prerequisites changed to: Ranger Level 4 (from 12). Ranger Extra Empathy I and any one of the following: Favored Enemy: Elemental, Ranger Energy Resistance Boost III, or Ranger Extra Empathy IV.
NEW – Bard Music of the Dead enhancement prerequisite changed to: Bard Level 6 (from 11). Any one of the following: Bard Extra Song IV or Bard Virtuoso I.
NEW – Bard Music of the Makers enhancement prerequisite changed to: Bard Level 9 (from 11). Any one of the following: Bard Extra Song IV, Bard Virtuoso I, Warforged Construct Thinking III, Lesser Dragonmark of Making.
The Follower of the <diety> Enhancement Lines now grant sub-abilities:

Tira's Champion: (Associated with Follower of the Silver Flame) Activate this ability to grant weapon proficiency in longbows to yourself or a friend until the target next rests. Consumes a use of turn undead.
Similar sub-abilities exist for the other faiths.

General

Extra Dragonmark I

Cost: 1 Action Point
Prereqs: Any Dragonmark, Level 2 Character, 3 Action Points Spent.
Benefit: Gain an additional use of your Least, Lesser, and Greater Dragonmarks per rest.

Extra Dragonmark 2

Cost: 2 Action Point
Prereqs: Any Dragonmark, Level 6 Character, 18 Action Points Spent.
Benefit: Gain an additional use of your Least, Lesser, and Greater Dragonmarks per rest.

Extra Dragonmark 3

Cost: 3 Action Point
Prereqs: Any Dragonmark, Level 10 Character, 33 Action Points Spent.
Benefit: Gain an additional use of your Least, Lesser, and Greater Dragonmarks per rest.

Extra Dragonmark 4

Cost: 4 Action Point
Prereqs: Any Dragonmark, Level 14 Character, 48 Action Points Spent.
Benefit: Gain an additional use of your Least, Lesser, and Greater Dragonmarks per rest.


Warforged

Warforged Brute Fighting I

Cost: 1 Action Point
Prereqs: Warforged Level 2, 3 Action Points Spent
Benefit: Activate this ability to cause your melee attacks to generate 10% more hate, making enemies more likely to attack you.

Warforged Brute Fighting II

Cost: 2 Action Points
Prereqs: Warforged Level 6, Warforged Brute Fighting I, 18 Action Points Spent
Benefit: Activate this ability to cause your melee attacks to generate 15% more hate, making enemies more likely to attack you.

Warforged Brute Fighting III

Cost: 3 Action Points
Prereqs: Warforged Level 10, Warforged Brute Fighting II, 33 Action Points Spent
Benefit: Activate this ability to cause your melee attacks to generate 20% more hate, making enemies more likely to attack you.

Warforged Brute Fighting IV

Cost: 4 Action Points
Prereqs: Warforged Level 14, Warforged Brute Fighting III, 48 Action Points Spent
Benefit: Activate this ability to cause your melee attacks to generate 25% more hate, making enemies more likely to attack you.




Items

NEW – Whenever you repair an item there is a chance it will be permanently damaged. Up until now, it has been impossible to see which items were permanently damaged when repairing items in bulk. From now on an alert will be sent to the chat window as well as the middle of your screen.
The House Jorasco Divine Reagent Vendor now carries Blessed Cold Iron Greatswords, Bastard Swords, Longswords, Shortswords, Scimitars, Warhammers, Rapiers, Dwarven Waraxes, Khopeshes, Mauls, and Heavy Picks.
New enchanted food and drinks are available in all taverns. Warforged also have new enchanted balms and tonics. The new drink and tonic restores 2500sp over 1 minute. The new food heals 500hp over 1 minute.The new balm heals 450hp over 1 minute.
Corrected the caster levels for Wands of Flame Arrow and Wands of Holy Smite to appropriate values for their spell level. Wand of Flame Arrow was reduced to Caster Level 5. Wand of Holy Smite was increased to Caster Level 7. Wands of Resist Energy was changed from Caster Level 1 to 3. These changes will affect the UMD difficulty of activating the wands as well as the wands gold value.
The Helm of the Black Dragon and the Helm of the Blue Dragon will now appear in the correct Clothing section of the Auction House. They were so pretty they were mistakenly put in the Jewelry category.
Randomly generated thrown Returning weapons will now correctly bypass their targets Damage Reduction.
Clarified the description of the Nullcloth Gown to make it obvious that the 15% Spell Failure applies to all spell casters, even Divine casters.
Corrected the naming for stacks of higher level Barkskin and Shield of Faith potions. They will now indicate their additional bonus eg Potions of Shield of Faith (+5).
You will no longer be able to attach items to mail messages that are not currently in your inventory (i.e., an item that is in your bank).


NPCs

Several enemy characters from the Aurum have had their alignment changed to Lawful Evil.
Many npcs were incorrectly insisting that they were "Race: Elf" in the examination window. This information has been removed from these lying npcs.
Niles Cage (Stormreach Harbor) is no longer performing an appendectomy on himself.


PVP



Quests

Made a change to help prevent quest items from becoming inaccessible if the party member who was carrying them dies or leaves the quest.
Ataraxia's Haven

Players will now always be able to exit the mine cave without difficulty.

Cerulean Hills

Rare Encounter Garunt will now have a treasure chest.

Menechtarun

The winds have shifted the sands of Menechtarun, revealing ancient roads.
Many of the named minibosses out in the desert of Menechtarun have gotten new supplies or found new sources of power. They are a fair amount stronger than before and will put up a better fight.

The Missing Ward

The hard and elite versions of Necromancer Gerti have had their spell lists fixed. They will no longer repeatedly cast the sleep spell.

Prison of the Planes

Cochitlehua has remembered that he has "Teleport Without Error" as an at-will spell-like ability.

Sorrowdusk Island

The named gargoyle Vermilo now functions properly (and his chest spawns on the ground).

Stormcleave Outpost

Made several changes to the pillars:

The Mephits have had their hide skill lowered so they should be easier to find
The Mephits now have a 60 meter leash so they shouldn't wander away
Changed an objective to read 'Alight the Pillars' to make it more clear that they need to be fully lit and fully active rather than just partially lit.


Xorian Cipher

The three named spectres in the Xorian Cipher quest, the Urdak brothers, have been changed into skeletons so they can no longer occasionally flee and leave you stranded in a locked room. They will be slightly more challenging to beat than they were before.



In Development
These items are in development and are scheduled for Module 5: The Accursed Ascension (Litany of the Dead Parts 3 & 4).

UI Improvements

Added active/toggle/passive usage to action tooltips.
Tooltips that display long cooldown periods will display them in minutes and seconds – e.g., 2 minutes 30 seconds instead of 150 seconds.
Action tooltips will inform the user when an action is useable in water, not useable in a brawl, or when it is useable only in public. They will also display the target type for the action.
Tooltips for skills now include the key ability.
Tooltips for spells and feats now include the save DC and save type(s).
Shopping

You can now ctrl-click on an item in a shop to purchase the item in bulk. A pop-up dialog will prompt you to enter the number of items to purchase. Note: This dialog is only used when purchasing items. There is still no way to control the number of items you sell from a stack.
When items in a shop are alphabetized, they are sorted first by base name (e.g. sword, dagger) and then by prefix (e.g. masterwork, vorpal).
When you add items to the shopping cart, the cumulative cost of the items in the cart will affect the "can afford" status of the items available for purchase / repair.
If a player's haggle skill changes, then the shopping cart display price will now update to reflect the change.

Spells

Spell tooltips now include blocks that describe whether or not a spell can be resisted, and what the specific material component is for a given spell (if any).
Spell tooltips now include a metamagic information block. This block lists the kinds of metamagic that can affect this spell.



Spells

The Crushing Despair FX are now persistent.


Skills, Feats, & Abilities

The number of Turn Undead attempts per rest will now be calculated on the current displayed Charisma modifier. Previously only permanent changes to Charisma from level advancement and tomes were counted.
The Listen skill now helps you detect hidden monsters.


Enhancements

NEW – Halfling luck, instead of only affecting Reflex saves, is now three distinct enhancement chains. These are not exclusive.

Halfling Luck (Fortitude) I

Prereq: Halfling Level 1
Cost: 1 Action Point
Grants a +1 bonus to Fortitude saves.

Halfling Luck (Fortitude) II

Prereq: Halfling Level 5, 14 Action Points spent, Halfling Luck (Fortitude) I
Cost: 2 Action Points
Grants a +2 bonus to Fortitude saves.

Halfling Luck (Fortitude) III

Prereq: Halfling Level 9, 29 Action Points spent, Halfling Luck (Fortitude) II
Cost: 3 Action Points
Grants a +3 bonus to Fortitude saves.

Halfling Luck (Reflex) I

Prereq: Halfling Level 1
Cost: 1 Action Point
Grants a +1 bonus to Reflex saves.

Halfling Luck (Reflex) II

Prereq: Halfling Level 5, 14 Action Points spent, Halfling Luck (Reflex) I
Cost: 2 Action Points
Grants a +2 bonus to Reflex saves.


Halfling Luck (Reflex) III

Prereq: Halfling Level 9, 29 Action Points spent, Halfling Luck (Reflex) II
Cost: 3 Action Points
Grants a +3 bonus to Reflex saves.

Halfling Luck (Will) I

Prereq: Halfling Level 1
Cost: 1 Action Point
Grants a +1 bonus to Will saves.

Halfling Luck (Will) II

Prereq: Halfling Level 5, 14 Action Points spent, Halfling Luck (Will) I
Cost: 2 Action Points
Grants a +2 bonus to Will saves.

Halfling Luck (Will) III

Prereq: Halfling Level 9, 29 Action Points spent, Halfling Luck (Will) II
Cost: 3 Action Points
Grants a +3 bonus to Will saves.


NEW – Human Versatility has undergone some revisions, and now grants five subabilities. Instead of being restricted only to a skill boost, Humans may now display their versatility by gaining a short duration increase to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class. These boosts draw from one common pool of 5.

Human Versatility I

Prereq: Human Level 1
Cost: 1 Action Point
Grants the ability to display your versatility as a +2 bonus to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class for 20 seconds.

Human Versatility - Skills I. Activate this ability to receive a +2 bonus to skills for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Damage I. Activate this ability to receive a +2 bonus to damage for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Attack I.Activate this ability to receive a +2 bonus to attack rolls for 20 seconds.

Human Versatility - Saves I. Activate this ability to receive a +2 bonus to saves for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Armor Class I. Activate this ability to receive a +2 bonus to armor class for 20 seconds.


Human Versatility II

Prereq: Human Level 4, 10 Action Points Spent, Human Versatility I
Cost: 2 Action Points
Grants the ability to display your versatility as a +3 bonus to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class for 20 seconds.

Human Versatility - Skills II. Activate this ability to receive a +3 bonus to skills for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Damage II. Activate this ability to receive a +3 bonus to damage for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Attack II. Activate this ability to receive a +3 bonus to attack rolls for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Saves II. Activate this ability to receive a +3 bonus to saves for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Armor Class II. Activate this ability to receive a +3 bonus to armor class for 20 seconds.


Human Versatility III

Prereq: Human Level 7, 21 Action Points Spent, Human Versatility II
Cost: 3 Action Points
Grants the ability to display your versatility as a +4 bonus to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class for 20 seconds.

Human Versatility - Skills III. Activate this ability to receive a +4 bonus to skills for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Damage III. Activate this ability to receive a +4 bonus to damage for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Attack III. Activate this ability to receive a +4 bonus to attack rolls for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Saves III. Activate this ability to receive a +4 bonus to saves for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Armor Class III. Activate this ability to receive a +4 bonus to armor class for 20 seconds.


Human Versatility IV

Prereq: Human Level 10, 32 Action Points Spent, Human Versatility III
Cost: 4 Action Points
Grants the ability to display your versatility as a +5 bonus to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class for 20 seconds.

Human Versatility - Skills IV. Activate this ability to receive a +5 bonus to skills for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Damage IV. Activate this ability to receive a +5 bonus to damage for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Attack IV. Activate this ability to receive a +5 bonus to attack rolls for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Saves IV. Activate this ability to receive a +5 bonus to saves for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Armor Class IV. Activate this ability to receive a +5 bonus to armor class for 20 seconds.

Deragoth
06-25-2007, 10:05 AM
Combat
NEW – Weapons with special damage effects no longer cause a sneak attack on an unsuspecting victim to be lost.Spells
NEW – Base cooldowns for Sorcerers reduced by 0.5 seconds for all spells (1.0 second for lingering effects.)

Sweet, thanks!

Khalai
06-25-2007, 10:08 AM
* NEW – Base cooldowns for Sorcerers reduced by 0.5 seconds for all spells (1.0 second for lingering effects.)


Awesome

Shadow_Flayer
06-25-2007, 10:10 AM
In QA

NEW – Bard Music of the Dead enhancement prerequisite changed to: Bard Level 6 (from 11). Any one of the following: Bard Extra Song IV or Bard Virtuoso I.
NEW – Bard Music of the Makers enhancement prerequisite changed to: Bard Level 9 (from 11). Any one of the following: Bard Extra Song IV, Bard Virtuoso I, Warforged Construct Thinking III, Lesser Dragonmark of Making.

Since these are in QA, I'm guessing that Bard Virtuoso is also, along with other new bard enhancements. Do you have any idea when we will get information about these new enhancements?

samhuinn
06-25-2007, 10:11 AM
Hurray operation Bard Love!!

# NEW – Bard Music of the Dead enhancement prerequisite changed to: Bard Level 6 (from 11). Any one of the following: Bard Extra Song IV or Bard Virtuoso I.
# NEW – Bard Music of the Makers enhancement prerequisite changed to: Bard Level 9 (from 11). Any one of the following: Bard Extra Song IV, Bard Virtuoso I, Warforged Construct Thinking III, Lesser Dragonmark of Making.

Freeman
06-25-2007, 10:12 AM
# NEW – Bard Music of the Dead enhancement prerequisite changed to: Bard Level 6 (from 11). Any one of the following: Bard Extra Song IV or Bard Virtuoso I.
# NEW – Bard Music of the Makers enhancement prerequisite changed to: Bard Level 9 (from 11). Any one of the following: Bard Extra Song IV, Bard Virtuoso I, Warforged Construct Thinking III, Lesser Dragonmark of Making.

I like this change, particularly for MotD. I still don't think Extra Song IV should be a requirement for it. Since this is being changed, how about giving us some more info on the new bard enhancements also?


NEW – Weapons with special damage effects no longer cause a sneak attack on an unsuspecting victim to be lost.

Now that you've gotten this out of the way, any chance at all that someone can work on the Crippling Strike issue?

Arjen
06-25-2007, 10:15 AM
NEW – Bard Music of the Dead enhancement prerequisite changed to: Bard Level 6 (from 11). Any one of the following: Bard Extra Song IV or Bard Virtuoso I.
NEW – Bard Music of the Makers enhancement prerequisite changed to: Bard Level 9 (from 11). Any one of the following: Bard Extra Song IV, Bard Virtuoso I, Warforged Construct Thinking III, Lesser Dragonmark of Making

Virtuoso I? Sounds neat, what the heck does it do and how many APs does it cost?

DareDelvis
06-25-2007, 10:16 AM
Some good fixes: Rogue backstabbing!
Also the permanent damage message a is nice touch.
I note the tease about Bards: "Virtuoso" but no description yet...
Thanks, hopefully it won't be too long for these changes...the game is getting a bit stale IMHO.
Cheers,
DD

Freeman
06-25-2007, 10:19 AM
Hmm, I went back and read through the Human Versatility changes. While I think this is a minor improvement, it doesn't address the main issue. It provides somewhat more versatility, but the overall complaint is the lack of any passive bonus, such as those enjoyed by every other race. No matter how nice the active portion might be, most players would prefer at least a choice of some useful passive bonuses.

mocat
06-25-2007, 10:21 AM
Virtuoso I? Sounds neat, what the heck does it do and how many APs does it cost?

Yes, enquiring bards want to know! :)

Brummbar
06-25-2007, 10:22 AM
Hi Samera,

So for the new Halfling Enhancements...

Do I need to choose the feat of 'Luck of the Heros' to open the Halfling Saving Throw enhancement chains?

Or will I be able to just select the enhancements when they go live without having used a feat to open up the line?

And Lastly..

Does it stack with EVERYTHING, and I mean most specifically, the Will Save portion. If it stacks with everything I can foresee alot more Halfling, Finess based, Dex Fighters moving forward with very high Will Saves....I know I'm gonna go that route with Dex Halfling Fighter.

Freeman
06-25-2007, 10:24 AM
Hi Samera,

So for the new Halfling Enhancements...

Do I need to choose the feat of 'Luck of the Heros' to open the Halfling Saving Throw enhancement chains?

Or will I be able to just select the enhancements when they go live without having used a feat to open up the line?

Thanks.

No, the feat is separate from the enhancement line, despite similar names.

Pellegro
06-25-2007, 10:26 AM
human versatility change is awesome! humans just stepped back into the spotlight. wow. this will definitely change how they're played.

dragnmoon
06-25-2007, 10:27 AM
Enhancements

NEW – Human Versatility has undergone some revisions, and now grants five subabilities. Instead of being restricted only to a skill boost, Humans may now display their versatility by gaining a short duration increase to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class. These boosts draw from one common pool of 5.Not sure If I uderstand this...

Is this 5 different enhancement chains or 1 Enhancement chain that gives you a Short Bonus to Skills, Dmg, AC, Saves or attack depemding on which you click?

Still not a fan of making HV a short boost... but I protest by not taking it :D and even with this change I still will not take it... I hate short boosts..:p

Mad_Bombardier
06-25-2007, 10:30 AM
Faster Sorcs, Ranger Empathy, Bard Musics, Halfling Luck, HV multi-use, new Rogue Assassin poisons, and ranged Sneak attacks. Wow! You guys have been busy! Thank you for taking the opportunity to do some house cleaning and minor tweaks/improvements. Now, I'm looking forward to Update 4.2.

(still not happy about Toughness, but will focus on the positive today.)

Aspenor
06-25-2007, 10:35 AM
I think this patch will be uber-sweet. Thanks guys :)

Forceonature
06-25-2007, 10:40 AM
In QA
Quests

Prison of the Planes
[list]
Cochitlehua has remembered that he has "Teleport Without Error" as an at-will spell-like ability.



Love all of the other highlights except for this one. When are you going to stop "adjusting" POP?

Hurin
06-25-2007, 10:41 AM
I'm assuming that the HV attack boosts will NOT stack with Paladin/Barb/Fighter action boosts? They pretty much duplicate them already.

I am hoping they will be on a separate timer though...

Mad_Bombardier
06-25-2007, 10:42 AM
Love all of the other highlights except for this one. When are you going to stop "adjusting" POP?Probably sometime when two level 10s can't duo it on Elite. ;)

Aspenor
06-25-2007, 10:46 AM
Love all of the other highlights except for this one. When are you going to stop "adjusting" POP?

Who cares? The Quori spirit drops like a tons of bricks. This won't change anything.

DKerrigan
06-25-2007, 11:06 AM
NEW – Way of the Assassin now has three different poisons available for use: Thoughtburn (Int damage and prevents casting for a short time), Icechill (Dex damage and slows the target's attack speed for a short time), and Soulshatter (Lowers the target's spell resistance by 10 and Will saves by 4 for a short time). Only one poison may be active at a time.

How many points of stat dmg? 1? This enhancement line is almost starting to look like it might be worth the 13 base AP needed to take it...:eek:

Forceonature
06-25-2007, 11:06 AM
Who cares? The Quori spirit drops like a tons of bricks. This won't change anything.

Is it for when he comes in, or while he's being engaged? I just hate how they keep changing this quest every time a patch is released. Just because a few Uber super-planned-from-the-beginning-with-all-of-the-raid-loot builds can run it in 15 minutes doesn't mean everyone can.

At what point do you make a quest too hard for Joe Averagebuild to complete?

DKerrigan
06-25-2007, 11:08 AM
Is it for when he comes in, or while he's being engaged? I just hate how they keep changing this quest every time a patch is released. Just because a few Uber super-planned-from-the-beginning-with-all-of-the-raid-loot builds can run it in 15 minutes doesn't mean everyone can.

At what point do you make a quest too hard for Joe Averagebuild to complete?

They'll quit changing this quest once either a) they make it such a PITA that it's run once on elite for favor or b) new content that hits higher loot tables is released (or c) all of the above, I vote C).

Dariun
06-25-2007, 11:09 AM
At what point do you make a quest too hard for Joe Averagebuild to complete?

Mod. 3.3.

ArkoHighStar
06-25-2007, 11:22 AM
Is it for when he comes in, or while he's being engaged? I just hate how they keep changing this quest every time a patch is released. Just because a few Uber super-planned-from-the-beginning-with-all-of-the-raid-loot builds can run it in 15 minutes doesn't mean everyone can.

At what point do you make a quest too hard for Joe Averagebuild to complete?


did this on normal with a pug full of 8-10's we almost wiped once and wiped at the end because myself and the other caster were out of mana, we came back in and he fell hard as we were abe to contain him and everyone had buffs. Most did not have uber equipment and 3 had never done the quest before. So this quest on normal is still easily within the reach of most non uber builds and regular players.

linaewen
06-25-2007, 11:26 AM
- please fix finger of death the way you are doing with fire shield and chill shield, empowering and maximize should NOT be applied to that spell, I hate when I waste 145 SPs for 30 damage.

- human versatility will still be useless without a lingering effect or a permanent effect just like it used to be.

Aspenor
06-25-2007, 11:27 AM
did this on normal with a pug full of 8-10's we almost wiped once and wiped at the end because myself and the other caster were out of mana, we came back in and he fell hard as we were abe to contain him and everyone had buffs. Most did not have uber equipment and 3 had never done the quest before. So this quest on normal is still easily within the reach of most non uber builds and regular players.

Considering we have completed this quest on elite with battlemages, a barbarian, no cleric and no proper arcane, yeah I'd say it's doable by all builds and regular players.

ArkoHighStar
06-25-2007, 11:33 AM
Considering we have completed this quest on elite with battlemages, a barbarian, no cleric and no proper arcane, yeah I'd say it's doable by all builds and regular players.

The problem is your average player might have troubles with this ques on elite, and you know what that is exactly what should happen, people often confuse elite with higher loot, instead of what it really means which is a higher difficulty and harder to succeed.
This game was play balanced at normal which means your average group of lvl 12-14 should be able to beat it at normal lvl, on elite their chance of failure should be much higher.

Roguewiz
06-25-2007, 11:43 AM
NEW – Weapons with special damage effects no longer cause a sneak attack on an unsuspecting victim to be lost.

Finally!

Cap_Man
06-25-2007, 11:49 AM
Regarding the changes to Human Versatility:

If I'm reading this right then there is no reason for a Human Rogue to take the 'Rogue Skill Boost' or 'Rogue Damage Boost' since you can get the same plus three more 'Boosts' for the cost of 1 enhancement line.

Currently the 'Rogue Action Boosts' and the 'HV Boosts' are on the same timer so you can't use both at the same time.

I think I like this, I don't have the 'Rogue Damage Boost' but I do have 'Rogue Skill Boost' so when this mod comes out I'll swap the 'Rogue Skill Boost' for the 'HV Boost' line and get more options for the same AP cost.

UtherSRG
06-25-2007, 11:51 AM
Love all of the other highlights except for this one. When are you going to stop "adjusting" POP?

They'll stop adjusting it when it is finally as hard as a level 14 quest should be. Right now I'd say it's about a 12. This adjustment might pop it up to a 13, maybe be right on track with a 14, depending on how much he 'ports about and how his 'porting interferes with his ability to screech for a new environment.

MysticTheurge
06-25-2007, 11:52 AM
Love all of the other highlights except for this one.

It's not highlighted because it was in last weeks WDAs.

Pellegro
06-25-2007, 12:09 PM
Regarding the changes to Human Versatility:

If I'm reading this right then there is no reason for a Human Rogue to take the 'Rogue Skill Boost' or 'Rogue Damage Boost' since you can get the same plus three more 'Boosts' for the cost of 1 enhancement line.

Currently the 'Rogue Action Boosts' and the 'HV Boosts' are on the same timer so you can't use both at the same time.

I think I like this, I don't have the 'Rogue Damage Boost' but I do have 'Rogue Skill Boost' so when this mod comes out I'll swap the 'Rogue Skill Boost' for the 'HV Boost' line and get more options for the same AP cost.


Not to mention, you can boost AC, or Attack rolls (!) too - up to +5.

Human paladins, human battlebards, human battlemages, human battle* - they all will have attack/damage/AC boosts as good as a fighter, PLUS skill boosts as good as a rogue, PLUS saves boosts.

Combine that with the extra AP use enhancements so you get 6 (or 7?) ...

Humans are looking really nice now, really nice.

Cowdenicus
06-25-2007, 12:14 PM
Still no info on warchanter, virtuoso or songblade makes baby jesus cry.

Freeman
06-25-2007, 12:17 PM
Regarding the changes to Human Versatility:

If I'm reading this right then there is no reason for a Human Rogue to take the 'Rogue Skill Boost' or 'Rogue Damage Boost' since you can get the same plus three more 'Boosts' for the cost of 1 enhancement line.

Currently the 'Rogue Action Boosts' and the 'HV Boosts' are on the same timer so you can't use both at the same time.

I think I like this, I don't have the 'Rogue Damage Boost' but I do have 'Rogue Skill Boost' so when this mod comes out I'll swap the 'Rogue Skill Boost' for the 'HV Boost' line and get more options for the same AP cost.

Unless you want the "Way of ..." line of rogue enhancements. I believe all of them require at least one version of the Rogue Action boost at level 2.

jkm
06-25-2007, 12:19 PM
i really like the HV changes, but we are soooo going to need an extra action boost line for HV now.

DKerrigan
06-25-2007, 12:25 PM
Unless you want the "Way of ..." line of rogue enhancements. I believe all of them require at least one version of the Rogue Action boost at level 2.

Correct, just don't look at the compendium for the correct implementation as far as prereqs go...find the release notes.;)

Xaxx
06-25-2007, 12:25 PM
Who cares? The Quori spirit drops like a tons of bricks. This won't change anything.

except when he "teleports without error" into the wall and no one can reach him while he spams force missles at you.

I have NO doubt that he's gonna screw up the quest regularly now

DKerrigan
06-25-2007, 12:27 PM
except when he "teleports without error" into the wall and no one can reach him while he spams force missles at you.

I have NO doubt that he's gonna screw up the quest regularly now

Or up to one of the doorways where melees can't reach...I know there's forcefields there and lightning traps, but I'll bet there's still a point that he would be able to teleport to...:)

GeneralDiomedes
06-25-2007, 12:48 PM
The Halfing Luck enhancment line is exactly what people had suggested as an alternative during the 3.3 feedback sessions. Thank you for listening.

As for the addition of more active enhancements, I believe they are a good thing and move the game somewhat further away from the largely simplistic swing-swing-swing until he's dead mode of combat that is currently prevalent.

About the only thing left that is wrong with the game is that we can mow down the enemy so fast through instakill or DPS that most of the flavor enhancements are just that; flavor.

Vienemen
06-25-2007, 12:57 PM
NEW – Base cooldowns for Sorcerers reduced by 0.5 seconds for all spells (1.0 second for lingering effects.)
....

NEW – Maximize and Empower options temporarily removed from Fire Shield and Chill Shield - these metamagics were not increasing the amount of damage dealt by the spells but were increasing the spell point cost of the spells.


Maybe instead of disabling them, the effort should be used to make them work properly. And as someone else already said...use the disable for Finger of death.

Samera
06-25-2007, 01:19 PM
Some of your questions will be answered in an article that is slated to be posted tomorrow :D

Cowdenicus
06-25-2007, 01:24 PM
Some of your questions will be answered in an article that is slated to be posted tomorrow :D

Bah tomorrow is a whole day away. Hmmm well can I get a "sneak peek" at the article so I can start the rumor mongering. :eek: :D

Wulf_Ratbane
06-25-2007, 01:27 PM
Regarding the changes to Human Versatility:

If I'm reading this right then there is no reason for a Human Rogue to take the 'Rogue Skill Boost' or 'Rogue Damage Boost' since you can get the same plus three more 'Boosts' for the cost of 1 enhancement line.

I'll swap the 'Rogue Skill Boost' for the 'HV Boost' line and get more options for the same AP cost.

Bingo. It is truly versatile-- not only in terms of what you can do with this one enhancement line, but also in terms of what you can do with the APs you might be able to free up.

This is a very good compromise fix.

Beherit_Baphomar
06-25-2007, 01:34 PM
NEW – Cleric and Paladin Unyielding Sovereignty now has significantly longer range (matching other healing spells) and requires line of sight to the target.







As Yno says Yay!

Coldin
06-25-2007, 01:34 PM
Some of your questions will be answered in an article that is slated to be posted tomorrow :D

Oooo..I look forward to it.

DareDelvis
06-25-2007, 01:39 PM
"If I'm reading this right then there is no reason for a Human Rogue to take the 'Rogue Skill Boost' or 'Rogue Damage Boost' since you can get the same plus three more 'Boosts' for the cost of 1 enhancement line."

-Rogues may still want their enhancement line for their Way of the...specializations...

KristovK
06-25-2007, 01:40 PM
Looks good so far, especially the fix to rogue sneak attack with elemental weapons.

As for the emp/max working with FoD...that's not a bug, it's supposed to work that way, does in PnP as well although in PnP those meta's with FoD actually serve a very useful purpose, the damage is commensurate with level to actually HURT a mob instead of tickling it. Hopefully disabling these 2 meta's with fire shield is just a temp situation so they can actually make them work properly.

Zenako
06-25-2007, 01:46 PM
Ummm, re bards and Level Min Levels on when they could take the Song of the Dead and Makers enhancements. From what I recall however, you need to be Bard 10 to even take Extra Song IV, so lowering the minimum to Bard 6 or 9 for the Maker or Dead songs does not help for a normal bard.

Freeman
06-25-2007, 01:47 PM
Ummm, re bards and Level Min Levels on when they could take the Song of the Dead and Makers enhancements. From what I recall however, you need to be Bard 10 to even take Extra Song IV, so lowering the minimum to Bard 6 or 9 for the Maker or Dead songs does not help for a normal bard.

The requirement will be Lingering Song IV OR Virtuoso I. Virtuoso can be taken at level 6, thus opening up the MotD at that point. If you choose not to take it, then you will have to wait until you can get Lingering Song IV.

Ransacked
06-25-2007, 01:48 PM
Looks like my two fighters will still be the only characters I have to get quest rewards generated outside the simple weapon proficiency.

:mad:

linaewen
06-25-2007, 01:50 PM
Looks good so far, especially the fix to rogue sneak attack with elemental weapons.

As for the emp/max working with FoD...that's not a bug, it's supposed to work that way, does in PnP as well although in PnP those meta's with FoD actually serve a very useful purpose, the damage is commensurate with level to actually HURT a mob instead of tickling it. Hopefully disabling these 2 meta's with fire shield is just a temp situation so they can actually make them work properly.


reminder: PK (phantasmal killer) CAN do 3d6 damage also and maximize/empower are disabled, I WANT the same fix for FoD (Finger of Death) as long as there is no way to set spells with feats in advance.

Zenako
06-25-2007, 01:51 PM
The requirement will be Lingering Song IV OR Virtuoso I. Virtuoso can be taken at level 6, thus opening up the MotD at that point. If you choose not to take it, then you will have to wait until you can get Lingering Song IV.

The notes indicate Extra Song IV not Lingering Song, and where is this Virtuoso I enhancement? I do not recall seeing it anywhere. Perhaps I am dense? Or is it a FEAT that you need to take to enable Enhancements, much like Toughness FEAT and Toughness Enhancements have synergy?

Gimpster
06-25-2007, 01:57 PM
As for the emp/max working with FoD...that's not a bug, it's supposed to work that way, does in PnP as well although in PnP those meta's with FoD actually serve a very useful purpose
It's either a bug or a stupid design.

Wizards who cast FOD want to kill the monster totally- they don't want to hurt it a little. Many wizards would be happier if they could turn off the damage portion of FOD completely so they don't pull aggro.

If DDO had a good system to control the use of meta-magic, so that you could turn it on and off instantly, or you could associate metamagics with a specific spell icon, then it would be OK to allow Maximized Empowered Finger of Death. In that case, it would be only the player's fault if he wastes 6x the mana on a FOD spell.

However, considering that DDO has no good way to toggle metamagics except push an icon and stand still waiting for a progress bar, Max/Emp should be disabled from FOD just like they are disabled for PK.

Freeman
06-25-2007, 02:03 PM
The notes indicate Extra Song IV not Lingering Song, and where is this Virtuoso I enhancement? I do not recall seeing it anywhere. Perhaps I am dense? Or is it a FEAT that you need to take to enable Enhancements, much like Toughness FEAT and Toughness Enhancements have synergy?

Sorry, I meant Extra Song IV. Virtuoso hasn't been added yet. That, along with Warchanter and Spellsinger, are new bard enhancements slated to be added in this update, with a min level of 6. I think the article Samera mentioned will have more info.

Elfvyra
06-25-2007, 02:22 PM
The requirement will be Lingering Song IV OR Virtuoso I. Virtuoso can be taken at level 6, thus opening up the MotD at that point. If you choose not to take it, then you will have to wait until you can get Lingering Song IV.

Ummm... Lingering Song IV is Level 14, and prerequisite of 48 points spent.
Leaving you with 2 whole points to spend once you've capped. Extra Song IV is Level 10 and 32 APs spent....

Freeman
06-25-2007, 02:23 PM
Ummm... Lingering Song IV is Level 14, and prerequisite of 48 points spent.
Leaving you with 2 whole points to spend once you've capped. Extra Song IV is Level 10 and 32 APs spent....

See the post right above yours...

Aesop
06-25-2007, 02:33 PM
All new items look nice... I like the Assassin Poison that reduces SR by 10... that could be useful :)

HUman Verrsitility is actually getting better. I myself don't like boosts too much but... I can deal. I can't recall can humans get extra Uses via an enhancment? One thing I'd like to see is a way to boost the time to 30 sec maybe a 2 tier Enhancment

Extended Boost 1 & 2

+5sec
+5sec

total of +10

costs 1 and 2 respectively

Aesop

Spookydodger
06-25-2007, 02:35 PM
Does Human Versatility stack with other bonuses to the same things? I would assume so. If so, is the cooldown timer shared?

If that's the case, could there be an increase to the duration timer?

If there's anything that could need a bonus (or double bonus, with a class ability), it would probably need longer than 20 seconds to activate, activate second boost, and then get in more than a few swings.

Maybe that's the intent. I just hate having to be so frantic about a boost.

Snioc
06-25-2007, 03:02 PM
"Rogue Subtle Backstabber is now an active enhancement that has a toggled stance. While turned on, you will generate less hate on melee attacks."




Why? Will it have a cooldown time? Can I have it and Combat Expetise up at the same time? If I use a spell like ability like a clickie will it break the backstabber mode like it does combat expetise? I smell yet another nerf. You just made all cooldown times hooked together, so now if I want to activate a haste I have to wait for the cooldown before I hit my rage or my power clickies.... now it seems your trying to force me to do this with the backstabber ability....so now I have to hit my power clickie, then my haste, then my combat exp, then my backstabber...the whole time waiting for the cool down time on each...hell the fight will be over. STOP KILLING MY STYLE! If this is not the case then nevermind...but what is the logic otherwise behind this move if not another nerf.



Snioc
Thelansis
Shadow Alliance

Freeman
06-25-2007, 03:17 PM
"Rogue Subtle Backstabber is now an active enhancement that has a toggled stance. While turned on, you will generate less hate on melee attacks."




Why? Will it have a cooldown time? Can I have it and Combat Expetise up at the same time? If I use a spell like ability like a clickie will it break the backstabber mode like it does combat expetise? I smell yet another nerf. You just made all cooldown times hooked together, so now if I want to activate a haste I have to wait for the cooldown before I hit my rage or my power clickies.... now it seems your trying to force me to do this with the backstabber ability....so now I have to hit my power clickie, then my haste, then my combat exp, then my backstabber...the whole time waiting for the cool down time on each...hell the fight will be over. STOP KILLING MY STYLE! If this is not the case then nevermind...but what is the logic otherwise behind this move if not another nerf.

Lots of discussion about this last week. No, it won't interfere with any of the other stances. You can turn it on and forget about it, basically. It isn't on a timer or anything else. Probably the only way it will get turned off is if you die, like any other stance. That might be slightly inconvenient for some people, but not a huge deal overall. Just one more "buff" to make sure you have on at the beginning of a quest.

Gimpster
06-25-2007, 03:25 PM
Does Human Versatility stack with other bonuses to the same things? I would assume so. If so, is the cooldown timer shared?
It doesn't stack now, so why assume they have changed it without mentioning?

binnsr
06-25-2007, 03:30 PM
Lots of discussion about this last week. No, it won't interfere with any of the other stances. You can turn it on and forget about it, basically. It isn't on a timer or anything else. Probably the only way it will get turned off is if you die, like any other stance. That might be slightly inconvenient for some people, but not a huge deal overall. Just one more "buff" to make sure you have on at the beginning of a quest.
Something that I just thought of, and may have been discussed in the 20,000 threads about this last week ..
Will it 'toggle' off when you use a spell, clicky, rage, etc. like Combat Expertise currently does? That could really be a problem for some folks..

Also, can I be in CE *AND* have Subtle Backstabbing active, or since it's a stance, do I have to choose which I will be using? If they can't be active at the same time, I'll be one unhappy rogue..

Freeman
06-25-2007, 03:37 PM
Something that I just thought of, and may have been discussed in the 20,000 threads about this last week ..
Will it 'toggle' off when you use a spell, clicky, rage, etc. like Combat Expertise currently does? That could really be a problem for some folks..

Also, can I be in CE *AND* have Subtle Backstabbing active, or since it's a stance, do I have to choose which I will be using? If they can't be active at the same time, I'll be one unhappy rogue..

Um, I believe I addressed every question you had in the post you quoted. Yes, it can be used with CE, Power Attack, and any other stance.(Dev responded as such) Using other abilities will not turn it off, nor will clickies, spells, rages, etc.

Azuremane
06-25-2007, 04:32 PM
Edited: Question asked and answered earlier in the thread.

Emili
06-25-2007, 07:39 PM
Not to mention, you can boost AC, or Attack rolls (!) too - up to +5.

Human paladins, human battlebards, human battlemages, human battle* - they all will have attack/damage/AC boosts as good as a fighter, PLUS skill boosts as good as a rogue, PLUS saves boosts.

Combine that with the extra AP use enhancements so you get 6 (or 7?) ...

Humans are looking really nice now, really nice.

I do agree it is nice for the lower bab classes... but 20 sec boosts do not go very far, you learn to use them on just bosses and other nameds where the fight can last a little beyond your 20 sec boosts. In the regular mob it's a bit of a waste as the sheer number of them in an encounter far exceed the 20 sec... and chaining it is not something you'd want to do.

For 5 to 6 encounters between shrines anyway... total 120 - 140 second, average gameplay between shrines is much more than that. I can speed run something like von 3 in 10 minutes average with the right group by shrine skipping, this of course means HV would cover 1/5 of the time. To a melee it is more attractive than any of the action boosts - ie.) fighter's attack boost etc... but I know very few people at all anymore who even consider those enhancement lines anymore since they do just as well without them via feats, buffs or by being a dwarf with an axe, or a elf with a longsword. Prior to the enhancement change mob many people had the boosts just as a lack of having little choice elsewhere and to be frank I used to boost my fighters to-hit to +52 to-hit with this on end boss's for 20sec - which of course lasted 1/5 of the fight if that.

At 10 ap's it will be a nice enhancement for human rogues, pallys and fighters who hurt for enhancements to begin with, Clerics bards and others who have an array of very useful enhancements to balance their mana, spells and fasicates will have a more difficult time making room for these.

All in all it does add to your options as a human.

riexau
06-25-2007, 11:43 PM
Thank you for fixing fire shield.

While it would have been nice to have max/emp work properly for it, at least I can use it now for those lava diving emergency escapes.

Uska
06-26-2007, 12:35 AM
Love all of the other highlights except for this one. When are you going to stop "adjusting" POP?

Considering the loot pop way to easy needs adjusting.

Uska
06-26-2007, 12:38 AM
Is it for when he comes in, or while he's being engaged? I just hate how they keep changing this quest every time a patch is released. Just because a few Uber super-planned-from-the-beginning-with-all-of-the-raid-loot builds can run it in 15 minutes doesn't mean everyone can.

At what point do you make a quest too hard for Joe Averagebuild to complete?

Can be done it a group with only so called avg build and avg gear if played smart with strategy

KristovK
06-26-2007, 02:33 AM
reminder: PK (phantasmal killer) CAN do 3d6 damage also and maximize/empower are disabled, I WANT the same fix for FoD (Finger of Death) as long as there is no way to set spells with feats in advance.

PK is an Illusion spell, and only does damage if the target fails it's Will save but makes it's Fort save, and that doesn't allow the meta's to work with it, in PnP or in DDO. FoD is not an Illusion spell, has 1 save or you die, make the save and you STILL take damage, so the meta's ARE supposed to work with it. Working as designed.


It's either a bug or a stupid design.

Wizards who cast FOD want to kill the monster totally- they don't want to hurt it a little. Many wizards would be happier if they could turn off the damage portion of FOD completely so they don't pull aggro.

If DDO had a good system to control the use of meta-magic, so that you could turn it on and off instantly, or you could associate metamagics with a specific spell icon, then it would be OK to allow Maximized Empowered Finger of Death. In that case, it would be only the player's fault if he wastes 6x the mana on a FOD spell.

However, considering that DDO has no good way to toggle metamagics except push an icon and stand still waiting for a progress bar, Max/Emp should be disabled from FOD just like they are disabled for PK.

FoD does 3d6 +1/level(25 max) on a save, that's not a bug, that's not bad design, that's how the spell works in PnP and in DDO. In PnP by time you get the spell, that's not much damage, but when you emp and/or max that spell expecting a mob to save, it's commensurate with level on the damage. In DDO that damage is admittedly laughable by the time you get the spell, even when emp/max is added in, but that's due to the inflated hp's of the mobs and that's a discussion that's been had over and over and over.

As far as casters running around with emp/max on all the time and casting FoD...PEBKAC issue. Turning a meta off is instant, and it takes all of 2 seconds(it's been timed many times) to enable a meta and you can enable them on the move, so the only reason people are wasting sp's using emp/max with FoD is simple laziness on the part of the player. I have yet to use emp/max when I didn't specifically want them active on my capped Wizard who I've played for over a year now, but I also don't run around with them enabled at all times.

Yes, it would be nice if they allowed another method of using meta's, but there's other threads on this subject in this very section of the Forums, with a rather interesting proposal by Mystic Theurge on changing them(I disagree with implementing it due to how DDO does spell/day/level but I like the idea itself). The best suggestion so far is to simply remove the timer on activating meta's, since doing what many ask for, allowing spells to be placed in the toolbars AS a meta'd spell would require 2-4 times the toolbars we already use, and I personally have 10 for my Wizard already and STILL don't have everything I would like in those toolbars, not to mention the screen clutter 10 toolbars causes.

Gimpster
06-26-2007, 03:04 AM
PK is an Illusion spell, and only does damage if the target fails it's Will save but makes it's Fort save, and that doesn't allow the meta's to work with it, in PnP or in DDO. FoD is not an Illusion spell, has 1 save or you die, make the save and you STILL take damage, so the meta's ARE supposed to work with it. Working as designed.
Every part of that is either wrong or irrelevant.

In PnP, if some idiot wants to maximize Phantasmal Killer so he can get a straight 18 damage on a save instead of 3d6, he's allowed to do it. The facts that a spell has one save or two, or is an illusion or not are irrelevant to the question of whether the designers intended it.

There are two possible designs that could be in play:
1. The PnP rules for what metamagics can apply should be used, meaning any spell which can inflict a variable amount of damage should allow Maximize and Empower.

2. As a convenience for the DDO players, metamagics which are 99% stupid to apply to a particular spell should not work on it.

Design 1 would mean both PK and FOD can be Empowered. Design 2 would mean neither PK nor FOD can be Empowered. Either of that would be self-consistent and could be claimed to be "Working As Intended". However, the current behavior where you can empower one but not the other is just nonsensical.

Gimpster
06-26-2007, 03:06 AM
As far as casters running around with emp/max on all the time and casting FoD...PEBKAC issue. Turning a meta off is instant, and it takes all of 2 seconds(it's been timed many times) to enable a meta and you can enable them on the move
Newsflash: sometimes I need to cast a spell NOW, not two seconds from now.


The best suggestion so far is to simply remove the timer on activating meta's, since doing what many ask for, allowing spells to be placed in the toolbars AS a meta'd spell would require 2-4 times the toolbars we already use, and I personally have 10 for my Wizard already and STILL don't have everything I would like in those toolbars, not to mention the screen clutter 10 toolbars causes.
Flat wrong.

If you could place meta spells on the toolbar, it could use LESS icons total. You wouldn't need to be switching metas on and off all the time, because spells could be pre-metad according to what is the best way to use them.

Elfvyra
06-26-2007, 03:06 AM
Just wondering how much farther you're going to deviate from 3.5 with regards to the Holy Sword spell? What I mean is, since you're not using the 3.5 duration and using Prot vs Evil instead of Magic Circle against Evil effect, will the Sword disappear when you switch weapons? Are you going to let Paladins give them away?

Lowniss32
06-26-2007, 06:30 AM
Do you devs think you can finally make this game fair and equal for all players and subscribers so they have the same chance on the loot tables? Being in this game and a beta player and basically playing Clerics for over a year and a half on Riedra. I can pretty much say that the loot is not equal for chests or end rewards for all classes in this game.
I play this game hardcore style. I have not once opened up the Auction House in this game. Not ONCE! Not many can speak that. I rely on what I pull or my good friends giving me. I have looted just as much as the rest and to see shields and maces all the time is not cool.
Maybe this is why it is hard to find good clerics like myself since they all know they get nerfed loot what is there to look for? Your money going down hill because no one wants to fund the healer.
Please FIX the loot and make it the same chances across the board for everyone. This isnt a "just a case of bad luck" because I have time in this game and that tells all.
Take care of the clerics that take care of you :)

Fatty -14 Clr
Hefty- 14 Clr
Tailor -14 Clr
Fattys - 6 Clr

Forceonature
06-26-2007, 06:43 AM
Can be done it a group with only so called avg build and avg gear if played smart with strategy

And what's wrong with that? I like the fact that it's an upper tier quest that only takes 30 min. to run. I can run it with a pug while waiting for guildies to log on. Not every quest has to be two hours long.

It just bugs me that the people who say it is too easy have a) run it a hundred times and b) ransack it every week. Then they complain that it is too easy and they're sick of running it so much. Well if it is too easy, then stop running it so much!

Ozy
06-26-2007, 09:04 AM
Love all of the other highlights except for this one. When are you going to stop "adjusting" POP?

When it becomes as difficult as the rest of the level 13/14 quests like the Cauldron, etc.

Ozy
06-26-2007, 09:06 AM
did this on normal with a pug full of 8-10's we almost wiped once and wiped at the end because myself and the other caster were out of mana, we came back in and he fell hard as we were abe to contain him and everyone had buffs. Most did not have uber equipment and 3 had never done the quest before. So this quest on normal is still easily within the reach of most non uber builds and regular players.

I thought you had to be level 10 before you could even GO to Gianthold?

Mad_Bombardier
06-26-2007, 10:52 AM
I thought you had to be level 10 before you could even GO to Gianthold?You have to be level 10 to get Wilderness Area XP. Any player can go to the GH quests for completion, favor, and loot.

boricua_in_cali
06-26-2007, 11:33 AM
In QA
These items are in QA and are scheduled for Update 4.2: Searing Heights.



NEW – Base cooldowns for Sorcerers reduced by 0.5 seconds for all spells (1.0 second for lingering effects.)

You can now ctrl-click on an item in a shop to purchase the item in bulk. A pop-up dialog will prompt you to enter the number of items to purchase. Note: This dialog is only used when purchasing items. There is still no way to control the number of items you sell from a stack.

The number of Turn Undead attempts per rest will now be calculated on the current displayed Charisma modifier. Previously only permanent changes to Charisma from level advancement and tomes were counted.





Sorceress Love, about time!!
Haggle monkey love, finally I can buy my spell components with 5 clicks, instead of 5 HUNDRED clicks!

a (GOOD) reason for Clerics to pump their CHARISMA some more, making them not so ugly, server-wide!! yay!

I'm pretty excited about this update.

Cheg
06-26-2007, 11:52 AM
In QA
These items are in QA and are scheduled for Update 4.2: Searing Heights.

Combat

NEW – Human Versatility has undergone some revisions, and now grants five subabilities. Instead of being restricted only to a skill boost, Humans may now display their versatility by gaining a short duration increase to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class. These boosts draw from one common pool of 5.

Human Versatility I

Prereq: Human Level 1
Cost: 1 Action Point
Grants the ability to display your versatility as a +2 bonus to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class for 20 seconds.

Human Versatility - Skills I. Activate this ability to receive a +2 bonus to skills for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Damage I. Activate this ability to receive a +2 bonus to damage for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Attack I.Activate this ability to receive a +2 bonus to attack rolls for 20 seconds.

Human Versatility - Saves I. Activate this ability to receive a +2 bonus to saves for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Armor Class I. Activate this ability to receive a +2 bonus to armor class for 20 seconds.


Human Versatility II

Prereq: Human Level 4, 10 Action Points Spent, Human Versatility I
Cost: 2 Action Points
Grants the ability to display your versatility as a +3 bonus to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class for 20 seconds.

Human Versatility - Skills II. Activate this ability to receive a +3 bonus to skills for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Damage II. Activate this ability to receive a +3 bonus to damage for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Attack II. Activate this ability to receive a +3 bonus to attack rolls for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Saves II. Activate this ability to receive a +3 bonus to saves for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Armor Class II. Activate this ability to receive a +3 bonus to armor class for 20 seconds.


Human Versatility III

Prereq: Human Level 7, 21 Action Points Spent, Human Versatility II
Cost: 3 Action Points
Grants the ability to display your versatility as a +4 bonus to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class for 20 seconds.

Human Versatility - Skills III. Activate this ability to receive a +4 bonus to skills for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Damage III. Activate this ability to receive a +4 bonus to damage for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Attack III. Activate this ability to receive a +4 bonus to attack rolls for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Saves III. Activate this ability to receive a +4 bonus to saves for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Armor Class III. Activate this ability to receive a +4 bonus to armor class for 20 seconds.


Human Versatility IV

Prereq: Human Level 10, 32 Action Points Spent, Human Versatility III
Cost: 4 Action Points
Grants the ability to display your versatility as a +5 bonus to skills, damage, attack rolls, saves, or armor class for 20 seconds.

Human Versatility - Skills IV. Activate this ability to receive a +5 bonus to skills for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Damage IV. Activate this ability to receive a +5 bonus to damage for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Attack IV. Activate this ability to receive a +5 bonus to attack rolls for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Saves IV. Activate this ability to receive a +5 bonus to saves for 20 seconds.
Human Versatility - Armor Class IV. Activate this ability to receive a +5 bonus to armor class for 20 seconds.






Will the Attack boost stack with Fighter Attack boost?

Freeman
06-26-2007, 12:00 PM
Will the Attack boost stack with Fighter Attack boost?

Yes. However, since they are on the same timer, you can only use one at a time :p

Gimpster
06-26-2007, 12:06 PM
I thought you had to be level 10 before you could even GO to Gianthold?
You must have a level 10 in your party.

KristovK
06-26-2007, 03:53 PM
I can't find the relevent passage in the SRD but I do remember seeing it, probably in one of the actual books you have to buy, but it does discuss Illusions and emp/max not working. Has to do with Illusions being just that, illusions, so you can't increase the damage because meta's are physical changes to the spells and you can't increase the damage an illusion does with them.

And do you even play a caster Gimp? I've got 10 toolbars for my wiz, mostly taken up with spells, and if I had to add in MORE slots for metamagic'd spells, I'd need another 10 or so toolbars for the possible combinations and that's ONLY for Heighten, Extend, Empower and Maximize. Firewall...Heightened. FW...Extended. FW...Empowered. FW...Maximized. FW...Heightened+Extended. FW...Heightened+Empowered...and so on...get the picture now? 1 spell with over 10 possible selections with only 4 meta's, now add in Enlarge and Quicken and the selections increase a good bit more. Basic math, try it sometime. Now, how in the hells you get that doing this would use up LESS slots is totally beyond me. As a friend of mine would say...and just what color IS the sky in your world sparky?

MysticTheurge
06-26-2007, 05:55 PM
I can't find the relevent passage in the SRD but I do remember seeing it, probably in one of the actual books you have to buy, but it does discuss Illusions and emp/max not working. Has to do with Illusions being just that, illusions, so you can't increase the damage because meta's are physical changes to the spells and you can't increase the damage an illusion does with them.

This would be the first I've ever heard of it.


And do you even play a caster Gimp? I've got 10 toolbars for my wiz, mostly taken up with spells, and if I had to add in MORE slots for metamagic'd spells, I'd need another 10 or so toolbars for the possible combinations and that's ONLY for Heighten, Extend, Empower and Maximize. Firewall...Heightened. FW...Extended. FW...Empowered. FW...Maximized. FW...Heightened+Extended. FW...Heightened+Empowered...and so on...get the picture now? 1 spell with over 10 possible selections with only 4 meta's, now add in Enlarge and Quicken and the selections increase a good bit more. Basic math, try it sometime. Now, how in the hells you get that doing this would use up LESS slots is totally beyond me. As a friend of mine would say...and just what color IS the sky in your world sparky?

Gimpster's point is that you usually wouldn't want all of those icons. You're generally going to have one version of the spell you cast with the appropriate metamagic feats applied. That would replace the current spell icon on your toolbar, and you wouldn't have to devote slots to the metamagic icons themselves.

Knightrose
06-26-2007, 06:51 PM
Ugh... why must we wait till Mod5 to get bulk-buying at the vendors?

Why is this so annoyingly difficult to award?

I don't know about other melees out there but I go through 3-500 Repair Serious potions in a play session.

I'm gonna ask Turbine to buy me a new mouse.

KristovK
06-26-2007, 09:26 PM
MT, if Gimp's suggestion is that you only put 1 meta'd version of a spell on your bar, then what do you do when you want to cast it with another meta, or mixture of meta's, or not meta'd at all? Open up the Character panel, flip to Spells, flip to the appropiate level and the appropiate meta and drag that to your toolbars? Uh...maybe it's just me, but that seems to be a LOT more of a pain then the current system. After all, if he's saying that having to just click an icon on the toolbar NOW is too much work(and he has), this sort of 'fix' would cause him to have a nervous breakdown! And you MT, playing a cleric, should know that you don't always cast any given spell with any given metamagic applied to it. Too many examples of why/why not to use meta's at any given time to even try to give any, and anyone who's played a caster, especially at higher levels, knows that you do NOT run around with meta's active, if they don't know it, they should go back to playing zergling tanks.

As for the Illusion and max/emp, I can't think of what book it was in, I don't have the 3.5 books, just the SRD, GM owns the actual books for 3.5, mine are a bit older..1st edition stuff. Figured I spent a small fortune 30 years ago on them, ain't doing it again when I can d/l the SRD and get the basics, especially if the GM wants to go spend HIS money on the books :) I'll see if I can find out the actual book/passages relevent...for all I know, it's an old 3.0 rule, never really bothered with it myself, PK isn't that useful in PnP, so I never really bothered with the spell, buddy plays a gnome illusionist and he was always wanting to meta PK with emp/max and that's what the GM read to us when he denied it. Made perfect sense to me as a player and GM myself, after all, Illusions are illusions, they don't DO anything to the target, the target does it to themselves, and metamagics alter the actual physical properties of spells(emp/max that is) and there aren't any physical properties to illusions to be altered. I know it worked the same way in NWN, couldn't emp/max PK but you could emp FoD(can't max FoD in PnP rules, level bump and all).

Gimpster
06-26-2007, 09:48 PM
Uh...maybe it's just me, but that seems to be a LOT more of a pain then the current system.
No. What's pain is turning ON empower for Scorching Ray, then turning it OFF for Finger of Death, then back ON for more Scorch, etc. Or turning ON Extend for Haste, then OFF for Hold Monster, then ON for Displacement, then OFF for Fear etc. Or worst of all, turning ON Heighten for Soundburst, then OFF for Cure Serious Wounds, then ON for Hold Person, then OFF for Mass Cure Light Wounds.


Too many examples of why/why not to use meta's at any given time to even try to give any, and anyone who's played a caster, especially at higher levels, knows that you do NOT run around with meta's active, if they don't know it, they should go back to playing zergling tanks.
If you could assign individual metamagics to spell icons, the concept of "run around with metas active" would no longer have any meaning.


As for the Illusion and max/emp, I can't think of what book it was in, I don't have the 3.5 books, just the SRD
You can stop right there. If it's not in the SRD (and its not brand identity), it's optional and there's no reason to expect DDO to follow it.

KristovK
06-27-2007, 06:35 AM
Are you refusing to see how what you are asking for increases the need for more and more toolbars Gimp or what? You'd want/need 3-8 icons for Scorching Ray alone...normal, emp'd, max'd, emp+max'd, enlarge, emp+enlarge, max+enlarge and emp+max+enlarge..provided you don't also have Quicken that is, which would again increase the number of slots by 4. So we go from having 4 slots used to having 8 slots used, or from having 5 to 12 with Quicken. And that's for a spell that Heighten and Extend aren't usable with, add that to another spell like FW and we add more and more slots.

If you don't understand that you do NOT cast spells with meta's applied all the time and that you DO mix and combine meta's on the fly then you just don't get it and have obviously never played a caster. You may start off with multiple meta's applied to a spell but as you keep casting, you run out of sp and you start disabling meta's to drop the cost and keep casting. Since DDO uses sp instead of spells/day/level and applying meta level bumps as PnP does, it's not a feasible system for the game and it WOULD increase the number of slots used for each spell combined with the various meta's that work with it. My wiz can cast X FWs with Heighten/Extend/Emp and Max applied, then I can cast Y with H/Ext/Emp and then Z with H/Ext/Emp and W with Ext/Emp and V with Ext and so on. I don't want to need to have 6+ slots for a single spell with various meta's applied or not when I currently have 5 slots to do the same thing and I DO NOT want to multiply that x6 for EACH spell I apply the same meta's to. I would literally need 20 or more toolbars for that setup and wouldn't be able to see the game screen through them all, and I'm only level 14, I have more spells coming as the game progresses and I gain 8th and 9th level spells and the commensurate spells/day as I level. I'd need 2 monitors to hold all the toolbars for all the spells and the possible combinations of meta's applied to them all.

I'm terribly sorry it's SUCH an inconvience for you to point an click Gimp, I know that it must waste just so much of your time that it drives you nuts. Maybe you should try LoTR:O or something, where you don't get options like this and it's all just a simple point/click and no thinking is involved. I did the closed beta, it's a fun game, absolutely beautiful looking, but I actually prefer thinking when I'm playing a RPG based game, if I want just twitch/point/click I play Battlefield2 or CS:S.

And Gimp, they are obviously using some of the non-SRD materials, since Eberron isn't in the SRD..can't find anything in the SRD about Warforged or Dragonmarks either.....

Seriously...sky..color...

MysticTheurge
06-27-2007, 06:51 AM
You'd want/need 3-8 icons for Scorching Ray alone...normal, emp'd, max'd, emp+max'd, enlarge, emp+enlarge, max+enlarge and emp+max+enlarge..provided you don't also have Quicken that is, which would again increase the number of slots by 4.

Why?

How often do you cast each of those versions of the spell?


If you don't understand that you do NOT cast spells with meta's applied all the time and that you DO mix and combine meta's on the fly then you just don't get it and have obviously never played a caster. You may start off with multiple meta's applied to a spell but as you keep casting, you run out of sp and you start disabling meta's to drop the cost and keep casting.

A lot of people metamagic everything they can, right up until they run out of SPs. Those people would be entirely unaffected by the change (except that they'd save a bunch of SPs not Maximizing FOD or extending Greater Command or Heightening Cure Serious Wounds).

If you really switch from Metamagic'd spells to non-Metamagic'd spells halfway through your SP bar, then yeah, you'd have more icons. But most people wouldn't and would significantly benefit from a system such as the one being described.

KristovK
06-27-2007, 07:21 AM
Sorry MT, but I know few casters who keep meta's going all the time and those casters don't get invited back to many groups outside of whatever guild they belong to...and even then their own guildy's often don't like running with them.

As for switching meta's on the fly, I do it constantly. I may start off with as many meta's to increase DC/damage as possible on a big mob or boss and cut off meta's as I use up sp. Reaver is a great example..I'll start with Ext and Heighten on, casting Disco and Mind Fog. Disco isn't affected by Heighten so it's not an issue leaving it active and it's increases the DC of the MF. If it's taking too long for the Reaver to activate the orbs, I'll drop Heighten since I'm going to be needing sp to try and control/banish the mobs when we get to the puzzle. If it happens that my wiz is one of the few left facing the Reaver while waiting on those orbs, I'll drop Extend and toss Burning Blood or Firewall at him to keep knocking down his hp, again keeping an eye on my sp total. Normally I always Extend both of those spells, but there are times like Reaver where I may or may not do that, depends totally upon the situation. If we've gotten the orbs lit and have the switch thrown quickly, I'll go ahead and emp/max/ext a firewall on the Reaver if I have enough sp to waste, it's fun to get that kill sometimes, or I'll do the same with a Burning Blood, or I'll run up and try to get the static charge to boost my sp while tossing off emp/max'd magic missiles, then emp mm, then just normal mm..then a wand of mm 9th until I do get the static charge/sp boost. Having done Reaver with 12/8/6 man groups, keeping an eye on my sp and careful control of which meta's I use is extremely important. And that's just ONE quest, I do the same meta/sp management on every single quest. Sometimes I want to extend all buffs, other times I don't, sometimes I want to emp/max all damage, sometimes I don't, it's entirely situational and having to have a slot for each spell for each possible meta and combo of meta's that I use...no thanks, I don't want that many toolbars, don't have enough monitors sitting around to put them on.

I guess I just don't run around with enough of the zergling casters who automatically have every possible meta on all the time. Oh..yeah..that's right, I tend to avoid bad players, that's why!

gemmal_trueshaft
06-28-2007, 06:15 AM
Prison of the Planes

Cochitlehua has remembered that he has "Teleport Without Error" as an at-will spell-like ability.

this will only cause problems for avarge groups if

A ...Cochitlehua uses it ever 2-3 seconds or as soon as he is hit he vanishess to a new location.

B ... you use no team work.

im sorry to say this but PoP needs more twiking. it should be at least as hard to complete as madstone and crucible..

to quote my kids fav TV show (wonder pets) whats gona work team work.

BlueLightBandit
07-01-2007, 04:58 AM
Prison of the Planes

im sorry to say this but PoP needs more twiking. it should be at least as hard to complete as madstone and crucible..


Why?

The Dev's have already stated that neither the level of a quest, nor the amount of favor given by a quest should be a factor in determining the actual difficulty of a quest.

It's just too difficult to determine the ability of the players to find a workaround (ala the dim door -exploit-) to a difficult obstacle.

They already have made some -improvements- to the difficulty of the quest, whether it was earth ele's to the air ele room, or the jariliths to the demon queen room.

I don't have a problem with the change they are making though. I just wish they would pay this much attention to other quests though. If other quests were tweaked in the same way they might actually be more fun, we would run the other quests and we wouldn't be running PoP all the time.

BTW, just because it's you think it's easy does NOT mean it should be changed. General rule of thumb: If you think it's too easy, or not enough of a challenge, then don't run the quest. Somehow instead of nerfing exploits, I wish they would nerf whining.

MysticTheurge
07-01-2007, 07:16 AM
The Dev's have already stated that neither the level of a quest, nor the amount of favor given by a quest should be a factor in determining the actual difficulty of a quest.

Uh, when?

legonares
07-01-2007, 05:18 PM
so when is searing heights going to come out...