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SickCat
11-30-2011, 10:15 AM
I very much like what's been going on with the development of ranged combat. The fixes to repeating xbows almost made me cry and the upgrade to 10k Stars had me openly weeping. That said, here's what I'd like to see; modify the Zen Archery feat to allow a monk archer (bow, xbow, shuriken, etc) to gain a point of Ki at a percent rate equal to their Wisdom score...or at least, equal to their Wisdom modifier. While it's interesting to put the bow away, go into melee combat to get Ki enough to activate 10k Stars, then put the bow back on, I'd like to be able to focus on the ranged aspect, and stay at range.

Alternate:
Make 10k Stars a stance that is always active.

Alternate to the above alternate:
Make 10k Stars a triggered effect that has a chance to put you into the trance while attacking at range. I don't really like this one, though...

Any other ideas for reasonably generating Ki at range?

EDIT: How about THIS...if you take the Zen Archery feat, Way of the Elegant Crane will provide Ki when using ranged weapons, just as it does for melee, that is, Ki returned on a critical hit? Yea? Yea? Right?

WruntJunior
11-30-2011, 10:46 AM
/signed

It would make sense for zen archery to give monks ki when they hit with a bow.

R0cksteady
11-30-2011, 11:45 AM
Fixing up ranged damage made you cry?

I'd hate to have been sitting next to you at the theater for Toy Story 3 :p

But seriously, yeah, good idea. But really, there are classes that need an upgrade to ranged still (Rangers and Fighters) before monks get more, IMO.

J1NG
11-30-2011, 11:55 AM
Hmmm... Not too sure it's really needed. Turbine already have support of this in place.

Peashoote build anyone?

I shoot slayer arrows all day already between Manyshot and 10k Stars in water stance. I only run out of ki when I want to.

What you suggest seems to be adding unnecessary ki generation. You don't use much for activating the ranged abilities anyway, so it sounds overkill. Unless you are asking for 10k Stars on a more permanent basis. In which case, I would also suggest that's overpowered. But that's just me. :)

J1NG

Jaid314
11-30-2011, 11:55 AM
you have 2 main options for ki generation while using ranged:

1) water stance, ki regeneration (you should also be able to stack it with ninja spy stealth/invis regen i think?)
2) earth stance, get shot a lot. as a ranged character, getting aggro is generally quite easy; mobs seem to obsess over ranged attacks ime.

now, for earth stance you might be thinking "what about raids?" well, it's generally not a problem so long as you're not squishy.

shroud: melee in part 1, pick a melee boss in part 2, no fighting in part 3, stand near harry and bask in the group heals (and get hit by the teleporting devils in between rounds) in part 4, stand near harry in part 5. just because you're a ranged character doesn't mean you *can't* get in there with the melee.

VoD: there are constantly spawning trash devils that should keep you charged.

ToD: again there is trash in part 1, shadow guy usually only lasts a minute anyways (maybe more on elite? if so, be the tank, or ask the healers if you can stand next to him? honestly, this isn't a hard fight anyways. you're gonna have good wisdom anyways, right? that can easily translate to good AC on a monk, plus damage mitigation from earth.) in part 3, there's orthons. most monks generate ki from them by killing them, you'll just have to let them hit you a few times.

DQ: if you have a hard time getting hit in this raid, please tell me your secrets. i'd like to know.

HoX: lots of stuff to get beat up by. renders all over the place, even.

stormreaver: depends on whether or not the air elementals count as meleeing you when they launch you across the map i guess. if not, you may have a hard time in this one raid... this can be resolved by using another stance for this one raid.

chrono: i personally have never had a problem finding trash to attack me.

tempest spine: you're kidding, right?

vault of night: once again, stand with the group.

titan: you're probably going to need it for 5 seconds, tops, to clear out the top of the pillars. quite possibly, you won't even be needed for that. running crystals, aiming the laser, and standing on the ladder don't require you to use 10k stars anyways.

LoB/MA: tbh, haven't run them yet. i understand there is some trash, but don't know how much. it is possible you will have to *gasp* use water stance for these two raids as well. but then, from what i understand, the to-hit bonus is probably not a bad idea anyways, and i doubt your bonus crit damage was adding up to much on a boss with higher-than-usual fortification.

did i miss anything? pretty sure that's all the raids...

SickCat
11-30-2011, 12:21 PM
Yea, I missed 50% of Toy Story 3 due to the water works...

I've considered the earth stance route, but, honestly, I don't want to count on it, since I don't really want to get hit. That said, I'm going to go, if possible, Ultimate Ocean AND Mountain...swap between the two as needed. Mountain is starting to look nice though...find a ranged mob, hit him a couple times in stance (70% threat should get his attention fairly readily) then leave him alone to feed you Ki. The thing with Ocean, however, is that between cooldowns it provides 12 Ki, assuming 1 Ki regenerated every 5 seconds (which is what I've found to be the case), and a regen time of 60 seconds (30 seconds in trance, 30 seconds on cooldown). To make up the other 8 Ki, you'll spend a total of 1 minute and 40 seconds getting enough Ki to re-enter the trance. Now, if you have things set up right, and you know what's going on with the Monk, you should be able to pop into trance whenever it's up (passive Ocean stance regen, passive regen while sneaking, and 2 meditates...assuming you went Dark...though, what benefit does light really provide that would be worth taking over Dark). That said, going into trance isn't the only thing I want to be albe to do. Shadow Form, Water Strider, Rise of the Phoenix (LOL) also require Ki. What I'm saying is, play styles differ and a ranged Monk, depending on the player might be starved enough for Ki that they can't pop into trance whenever it's up.

Here's something I haven't tested...does Crane provide Ki on crits for ranged? I want to say it doesn't, but that would solve this issue for me entirely.

EDIT: Tested...Crane path does NOT provide Ki on crits while using a ranged weapon :(

Jaid314
11-30-2011, 12:44 PM
if you build up a decent amount of ki from the trash in earth stance, water stance will last you a lot longer.

DustTheWind
07-30-2012, 03:15 PM
I personally think that ki generation using way of the elegant crane would be perfect honestly except that it seems to favor weapons that have a larger crit range. But then again the game already favors weapons that have a greater crit range. Banishment for example. But anyways still I think that particular idea is a good idea. It's not over powered and gives people an oportunity at early levels to gain ki. "@ early levels"... Not at level 16 in water stance 3... with out ahving to go into melee.

I vote for this.

\signed.

necro? I don't think so. Its still an issue that this post adresses well.

Edit1:
Shruikens could certainly use some beefing up a bit

Ravoc-DDO
07-31-2012, 12:35 PM
How about the removal of arrow compatibility with 10k stars and buff shurikens instead with full Ki generation and application?